Hillary Mann Leverett to Argue that “The West Should Get Out of Bed with the House of Saud” in Upcoming BBC/Intelligence Squared Debate

On Thursday, May 28, at 6:45 in Cadogan Hall, London, Hillary will take part in an Intelligence Squared debate, “The West Should Get Out of Bed with the House of Saud”; the debate will subsequently be broadcast by BBC and posted as a podcast.  Hillary and Egyptian-American journalist Mona Eltahawy will argue for the motion; arguing against will be Jamie Rubin, former spokesman for Secretary of State Madeleine Albright during President Clinton’s second term, and Sir Alan Duncan, a Conservative MP and former Minister of State for International Development.  Readers in London can click on the link above for tickets.

Also, Hillary appeared last week on Press TV’s The Debate to discuss the ongoing nuclear talks between Iran and the P5+1, see here.

Flynt Leverett and Hillary Mann Leverett  


312 Responses to “Hillary Mann Leverett to Argue that “The West Should Get Out of Bed with the House of Saud” in Upcoming BBC/Intelligence Squared Debate”

  1. Rehmat says:

    I must say, it’s an antisemitic demand since the Saudi ‘royals’ too have Jewish family roots and their monarchy was established by the UK’s foreign office to check on political Islamic revival.

    Currently, though Saudi Arabian oil has not much attraction for United States – Riyadh has succeeded in buying American Jewish Lobby by donating $12-16 billions during the last two years.

    After failing to create its own lobby group as powerful as the Jewish Lobby, Saudi ‘royals’ came to the conclusion that if you cannot beat it, buy the Jewish Lobby for them by currying favors to the Zionist entity with money and by joining Tel Aviv’s jihad against Iran.

    “By crashing the (US-Iran nuclear) deal, Israel and Saudi Arabia would open the door to more punitive sanctions on Iran and possibly clear the way for Israeli airstrikes, with Saudi Arabia granting over-flight permission to Israeli warplanes. The Saudi-Israeli tandem also might hope to pull in the US military to inflict even more devastation on Iranian targets,” says Robert Parry, American investigative reporter and author.


  2. nico says:


    By Gordon Duff and Jeff Smith, Editors
    “A video received from Yemen, believed to be taken May 20, 2015, of an explosion, when analyzed by nuclear weapons experts is, by very high probability, a neutron bomb that could only have been an Israeli attack. The analysis:…”
    Jeff Smith is a nuclear physicist and former IAEA inspector.

    Many assumptions in this article that would need to be double checked.
    Video source ? Why Israeli and not US fighter jet or a Pakistani procured bomb ?
    Interesting nonetheless.

  3. Jay says:

    West’s death squad strategy: How and why ISIS & Al-Qaeda became ‘shock troops’ of global powers


    Putin’s recent remarks is acknowledging the “shock troop” strategy — diplomatically of course.

    For the West to get out of bed with the House of Saud requires the undoing of “shock troops” — something the West does not have the stomach for.

  4. Tuyzentfloot says:

    I’m not disagreeing with Hillary here, but I think the change of direction she has in mind for the US and the repercussions it will have on its relations with other states is more radical than what people think of when just favoring ‘strong’ rapprochement with Iran.

  5. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 26, 2015 at 8:46 pm

    Only if wishes could come true!

  6. Smith says:

    So Iran is about to sign on Additional Protocol. As if NPT was not enough. Har chi sareto kham koni payeen, bishtar tosari mikhori. Congrats. The deal has started to look more and more like the deal Libya did with US. And the “scientific cooperation” at Fordo has also been debunked (See here: http://goingtotehran.com/obama-panders-to-gcc-states-over-a-prospective-nuclear-deal-with-iran-leverett-and-marandi-on-cctvs-the-heat#comment-86252 ). Under this deal, US is about to get all it wants, while Iran will get only a slap on the face and a kick in the ass. Enjoy it.

    In other news, France announced that under additional protocol Iran must give immediate access to all places in Iran including military sites, Mr Khamenei’s house, holy graves at Qom and Mashhad, and even the shower rooms at girl schools 24/7/365 with online video and audio monitoring.

    This time the cargo is going to have a steep price. The iPhone7, Airbus and Peugeot will come with thick strings attached to them. Enjoy it, dear cargo cult. ROFL.

  7. Nasser says:

    Dr. Hunter too doubts Iran would get the deal it wants

  8. fyi says:

    Mr. Smith & Nasser:

    The plain fact is that only the Iranian Armed Forces stand between ISIS and the oil wells of Persian Gulf – in Iran, in Iraq, in Kuwait, in Saudi Arabia etc.

    Axis Powers and Russia loath – absolutely loath – to settle with Iran at the strategic level.

    They are still trying to find scope to leverage ISIS against Iran and her allies.

    They are, in my opinion, too late.

    Dr. Hunter is correct that Axis Powers have a choice to make, and they are doing their utmost to not make that choice.

    In 1953, in 1980, in 1994, in 2003, in 2007, in 2010, and in 2012 they also faced choices vis-à-vis Iran.

    In every case, excepting 2012 when their choice was war with Iran, they chose incorrectly.

    Mr. Obama and a few others US planners seem to have grasped that they had exhausted their choices (even before the emergence of ISIS).

    Others evidently have not yet realized that – inside or outside of US.

    I think Iran is in a pretty strong position and should be ready to walk out.

    And then make a deal with ISIS and let it go after Jordan and Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.

  9. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    May 27, 2015 at 2:03 pm

    Yes, I agree. Investments abroad when they can be gobbled up by Europeans or Koreans is sheer stupidity.

    At least finally Mr. Rouhani has publicly acknowledged that Iran in an economic war with major sectors of her economy under occupation of foreign enemies.

  10. fyi says:

    Tuyzentfloot says:

    May 27, 2015 at 4:42 am

    I agree; there are too many very rich and very powerful interests in US tied to the House of Saud – even much more so than the case of the late Shah of Iran.

    May be once Jordanian monarchy is destroyed by ISIS….

  11. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    May 27, 2015 at 1:51 pm

    When ISIS emerged in Iraq; Americans could have used their 15,000 troops stationed in Kuwait, together with the Jordanian Army elements to attack and check its advance.

    They chose not to do so since they thought that they could leverage ISIS against Iran and they also did not want to use up their forces in Kuwait for any future war against Iran.

  12. Nasser says:

    Silly Iranians when will they ever learn

  13. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    May 27, 2015 at 2:53 pm

    I am satisfied that the Iranian leaders are aware of all of this.

    On the other hand, 800 years of debating the Zakat of a three-year old female camel cannot be overcome during the 35-year long nationalistic rule of the Islamic Republic.

  14. Nasser says:

    Mr Smith and fyi,

    Once again many thanks for educating us all.

  15. Karl.. says:

    IAEA imply right to visit military places inside Iran.

  16. Nasser says:

    Did Mr. Smith finally shame them enough into finally finally finally making some modest changes

  17. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    May 27, 2015 at 6:01 pm

    People died in Iran when the French sold tainted blood to Iranians.

    My young friend, a hemophiliac in US, died of AIDS – he was only 16; towards the end he wanted to die – they had cut out his eye because of the pain caused by growth of tumors inside his eye-sockets.

    He and everyone else – they all deserved better.

    But they had no chance.

  18. Amir says:

    I had heard (back in 1380-81, and I think last month) that PROBABLY the whole nuclear program received priority because it was assumed to be a sort of bargaining chip; to receive “security guarantees” from the US (in exchange for scaling down on the more strategic aspects of it).

    The security has been achieved through other means, but Mr Rouhani is determined to trade the nuclear card away for “something”; one day he said it could be used to remove all sanctions (starting after US embassy hostage crisis), now limits on exporting oil.

    There is likely to be no meaningful deal; the US isn’t willing to give us what we want (immediate sanction relief, unfreezing our assets, lifting limits on oil export, lifting limits on sale of items with dual use, etc), and we don’t need what US is ready to offer (security guarantees, recognition as legitimate government of Iran, setting diplomatic relations and opening embassies). If anything, the things US is willing to give us are against our national interests.

    Logic of negotiations is gradually fading away in the see-saw of nuclear talks. They don’t have anything of particular value to us. We are not willing to give them anything of use [to them].

    AND! The liberals, market-economists, progressives (and others) had their chance and they blew it. Soon, with a new president in the White House, things would be back to the way they were.

  19. Amir says:

    Ah! I forgot! I wanted to say this nuclear card was supposed to buy us security; if nuclear negotiations are opening the way for more inspections, spying and espionage, assassinations etc., do we really have to continue this? I’m not an expert, I’m just asking.

  20. M.Ali says:

    Amir, I think Rohani & co put themselves in a corner. They came on a platform of improving the economy by removing the sanctions. They have now wasted 2 years by giving excuses and they can’t suddenly say, we didn’t sign an agreement.

    Its possible they will force the military khameimi to stop a bad deal so they can say, “we wanted to solve everything and make yours lives better but they didn’t let us” to the people.

  21. M.Ali says:

    I meant the military OR khameini

  22. Amir says:

    M.Ali says:
    May 28, 2015 at 4:00 am

    I had always (for the past two years) assumed that Rouhani was here to mend the rifts; if he would resort to this tactic, he has failed on two fronts. Not only sanctions haven’t been eased, but also tensions between opposite views would get heightened.

    What you said sounds like something that Rouhani would do, but that kind of rhetoric from a security official of the state for the past 3 decades is a reason for greater embarrassment.

  23. Ferri says:

    Dear all:

    While I have not posted any comments, I have been reading the articles published by the Leveretts since they started the web-site both “Race for Iran” and then “Going-to-Tehran”. I have also been reading the comments. This is one site I rely on for both excellent and educational articles as well as comments.

    With respect to the recent negotiations – I believe that despite the efforts of the Iranian negotiating team in arriving at some sort of beneficial deal between the P5+1 and Iran, it is quite obvious that there is no real intention on the part of the US to arrive at a point of mutual interest. It’s a take-it or leave it option. Many of us knew this even before the start of these negotiations, but once again the Rohani Admin./negotiating team unfortunately, believed that a different method of negotiations with the US under the Presidency of Obama could break this impasse.

    It has not.

    I have tried to review as many newspapers published in Iran on this subject as well as comments posted in order to obtain a general flavor of what the Iranians think of this deal. The Iranian people are not stupid. They post very intelligent comments and they understand the details of every aspect of the NPT, the Additional Protocol and “enhanced access”, US Foreign Policy and its intentions for Iran etc…

    Referring to what M.Ali says:

    May 28, 2015 at 4:00 am

    I see many comments from the people relaying the same opinion as Mr. Ali.

    The Supreme Leader has said in so many words, he never believed in these negotiations, he didn’t trust that the US would change its color toward Iran but allowed the negotiating team to proceed forward if they believed that there was a possibility of arriving at a just and equitable deal; but he cautioned the negotiating team that they have to bear in mind not to cross his red-lines which he has repeated over and over again.

    The red-lines have been crossed!! His red-lines are very logical; they have to do with the national security of the country, the independence and sovereign rights of the country; the security of its people, nuclear scientists, researchers; and military sites and officials; as well as continued advancement in R&D.

    If the Rohani negotiating team has finally seen the light, they cannot place the burden of walking away by placing the burden on the Supreme Leader of Iran. He told them up-front what he expected. They should be man enough to tell the Iranian people the truth and get themselves out of this never ending negotiations which are leading to no where, a waste of time, further placing themselves in a quick-sand that they can’t get out of and just buying time for the US and its allies.

    The Iranian people will not blame the Supreme Leader; they will also not place the blame on the negotiating team; they will place the blame on the US for its over-reach and unreasonable demands – demands that no other country would accept.

  24. fyi says:


    From Ambassador Bhadrakumar:


    As I stated before; Iran and Syrian should make a deal with ISIS….

  25. Rehmat says:

    fyi – There is no denying to the fact that Netanyahu is the only leader in the Middle who has supported ISIS in public.


  26. Amir says:

    Ferri says:
    May 28, 2015 at 9:25 am

    If I might make a comment, polls by (I think but I’m not sure) Gallop in 2013 (or 2014?) showed the Iranian public generally support the Nuclear program; they also supported nuclear negotiations, and it said Iranians are more likely to blame the West in case of the break-down of the negotiations, rather than Iranian [negotiators].

    So… yes, the public (majority of it at least) isn’t going to blame the hardliners, or the military or the Leader or others. The US’ inflexibility is obvious.

  27. Amir says:

    Oh my! It’s Gallup! Hoe embarrassing!

  28. Ferri says:

    Amir says:

    May 28, 2015 at 11:57 am

    Dear Mr. Amir, I agree 100%. From everything I have read, it seems like across the board people are pro-negotiations. The US likes to divide anyone who opposes the deal based on logic as hardliners; but that’s not the case. I also take a look at the “supposed hardline newspapers” – they don’t brush the deal off because they don’t want to negotiate-they provide reasons, and facts why the deal doesn’t provide any benefit for Iran. Even if you wanted to have a symbolic nuclear program which this is beginning to look like – when there is minimal if any sanctions relief; when there is no lifting of sanctions; when for any excuse under a different title (i.e. human rights abuse, support for terrorism etc..) you can reinstate sanctions – while Iran has to dismantle its program; when you want to inspect any place you want including sensitive military sites; meet whomever you want (and provide the list to IAEA inspectors to distribute to Iran’s enemies)- Iran has to be really dumb to agree to such a deal; and they are not dumb. If the Gov. explains exactly what is going on to the people – the logic will make total sense to the people. As such, if the US is doing this in the hopes that there will be an internal uprising similar to the so called “green movement” ( brought to Iran courtesy of the US)in the hopes of a regime change brought on internally by the people; or divide the people into different camps – its not going to happen. The people are even more aware of these tactics than they were in past.

  29. Nasser says:

    So once your country is militarily and economically secure, all you have to worry about are such laughable silliness (asymmetrical warfare). Other countries should be so lucky


  30. Amir says:

    Thanks for your reply. Just to avoid any confusions, I used “hardliners” as an understandable lable; my friends and colleagues think I’m a hardliner while I think I have a few correct ideas as well.

  31. Kooshy says:

    Ferri good to see you post but there is a problem with what you said, just to let you know I am not try to defend Mr. Ruhani or his

    “Many of us knew this even before the start of these negotiations, but once again the Rohani Admin./negotiating team unfortunately, believed that a different method of negotiations with the US under the Presidency of Obama could break this impasse.”

    These negotiations started at the end of Dr Ahmadinijad administration and not at Mr Rouhani’s but he knew about them since he was in SNSC per Mr Salhi and also SL. He opted for more PR styled approach with SNSC’s approval. IMO I think the circle of Iran’s national security decision makers once they realize that Iran has achieved the nuclear capability and know how, they correctly thought since we are not going to have or operate another Nuclear reactor for at least another 10 years, or need in making our own fuel for ten years to come , and since the west will not ease up or let go of her hostilities toward Iran for many more years to come. Therefore it would be worth while to see and explore if they are willing to accept our nuclear capability status and reduce their hostilities to a minimum of a detente status.
    As long as Iran can maintain her minimum nuclear capability status for a retaliatory strike, her R&D, and receive fuel for her operational reactors, she can negotiate on a time period to hold these minimum security essential for detente status which by itself if achieved will ad to her security in all sort of matters. I think based on these minimum the SL redlined have not been crossed. From what I have read and heard of Ayatollah Khamenaie, I don’t think in his Pearson and his very nationalistic vibes he be shy or scared to stop where he feels will weaken
    Iran’s defenses. IMO his redlines are nation’s pride, interests, and expediency. I am in believe that so far he has done a very good service for this country.

  32. Kooshy says:

    One needs to ask if in 1945 when U.S. Nuked Japan, Japan had a retaliatory second strike capability, would nation of Japan submit to US and surrender, or even before that if US knew Japan had a nuclear capability to strike back and some point in few months would have US used nukes on Japan, that’s the whole point of Japan option.IMO the answer to both questions is No. The reason Cuban missile case.

  33. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    May 27, 2015 at 6:01 pm

    I doubt it. They are a very shameless bunch. The primary preoccupation is not with such matters of life. It is rather with matters of death: http://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D9%85%D8%AD%D8%B3%D9%86_%D8%A7%D9%85%DB%8C%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B5%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C

  34. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    May 27, 2015 at 3:27 pm

    Your are welcome! And here is something that we all can learn from (except the cargo cult of course):

    Lee Kuan Yew on what must individuals, companies and countries do to succeed in a globalized world:

    “In an era of rapid technological change, Americans have shown that those countries with the largest number of startups, especially in IT industry, which venture capitalists finance, will be winners in the next phase… Japanese, Koreans and other East Asians have to accept some fundamental cultural changes to compete in a globalized marketplace. Those whose culture help them to absorb and embrace talented people of difference cultures to be part of the new corporate culture will have an advantage. Japanese and East Asians are ethnocentric, close knit societies. They do not easily absorb foreigners into their midst. There has to be a fundamental change in cultural attitudes before Japanese and other East Asians can compete with the Americans who do, because of their different history, easily absorb peoples of different cultures and religions into their corporate teams.

    The digital revolution and the convergence of communications, computers, and the media require more from us than simply copying the software innovations of the developed countries. Our enterprising young people must be given the space and scope to create businesses for themselves. The government must facilitate the venture capital funds. We have followed a safe, structured approach. Now, our talented youths have to dispense with the safety net as they go on their own. Many will stumble and fall, but they must pick themselves up and try again. The process of opening up may make our society more unruly. The gravest challenge will be to protect the values we cherish… If you want to thrive in the modern world, then you must not be afraid.

    Technology has created a more level playing field,… because goods and services can be manufactured or produced anywhere, this has reduced the traditional competitive advantages of geographic location, climate and natural resources… It helps to close the gap between advantaged and disadvantaged countries. But one “X” factor remains a key differentiator specially for developing countries: that is ethical leadership… A clean, efficient, rational, and predictable government is a competitive advantage (in business).”

    Lee Kuan Yew on what is China’s strategy for becoming number 1 and the challenges on the way:

    “Theirs is a culture 4000 years old with 1.3 billion people…. How could they not aspire to be number 1 in Asia and in time the world? Every Chinese wants a strong and rich China, a nation as prosperous, advanced and technologically competent as America… This awakened sense of destiny is an overpowering force. In Chinese, China means “Middle Kingdom”, recalling a world in which they were dominant in the region, other states related to them as supplicants to a superior, and vassals came to Beijing bearing tributes: For example the sultan of Brunei who carried silk as his offering but who died there four centuries ago and now has a shrine in Beijing.

    The Chinese have concluded that their best strategy is to build a strong and prosperous future, and use their huge and increasingly highly skilled and educated workers to out-sell and out-build all others. They will avoid any action that will sour up relations with United States. To challenge a stronger and technologically superior power like United States, will abort the peaceful rise of China.

    China is following an approach consistent with ideas in the Chinese Television series The Rise of Great Powers, produced by the (communist) Party to shape discussion of this issue among the Chinese elites. The mistake of Germany and Japan was their effort to challenge the existing order (resulting in world war I and II). The Chinese are not stupid; they have avoided this mistake…. China understands that its growth depends on imports, including energy, raw materials and food… China also needs open sea lanes. The Chinese have calculated that they need 30 to 40 or maybe 50 years of peace and quite to catch up, build up their system, change it from the communist system to the market system. They must avoid mistakes by Germany and Japan. The Russian mistake was that they put so much into military expenditure and so little into civilian technology. So their economy collapsed.

    I believe the Chinese leadership has learnt that if you compete with Americans in armaments, you will lose. You will bankrupt yourself. So avoid it, keep your head down, and smile, for 40 or 50 years.

    To become competitive, China is focused on educating its young people, selecting the brightest for science and technology, followed by economics, business management and the English language.

    Internally the chief challenges are culture, language, an inability to attract and integrate talent from other countries and in time governance. Even if China was as open to talented immigrants as the US, how can one go there and integrate into society without a mastery of Chinese? Chinese is a very difficult language to learn. One can learn conversational Chinese after a few years but it is very difficult to be able to read quickly.

    China will inevitably catch up to the US in absolute GDP. But its creativity may never match America’s, because its culture does not permit a free exchange and contest of ideas. How else to explain how a country with four times as many people as America [and presumably four times as many talented people] does not come up with technological breakthroughs? Can Chinese break free from their own culture? It will require going against the grain of 5000 years of Chinese history.”

  35. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 27, 2015 at 2:24 pm

    Yes, that is true.

    The head of ground forces of Iranian Army just a few days ago asked the government and parliament to allocate funds for buying tanks and said that Isis is getting nearer to borders of Iran.

    An army without armor is like a man without phallus.

    27 years after the war in which Iran’s Shah purchased armor divisions were decimated, here we are, with no new purchases and no local capability to serial produce 5000 tanks that Iran needs. After all, they have not yet been able to produce internal combustion engines necessary for powering a tank. No material research institute to develop modern armor like Chobham. No electronic industry to produce tank battle management electronic system. All they did was cut off the ass of old Chieftains and weld it to the head of Pattons and put a T-72 turret on top with a Russian engine and call it Zulfagar. The only thing Iranian about it was the name (or maybe even not that). That also never serially produced since they run out of Chieftain ass.

    It is going to be back to days of teenagers sacrificing their cartilage and bones to hold a line at the front. The money was invested in Dubai that had to go for development of internal combustion engines. The teenagers who were to drive safe and powerful tanks protected by armor are now to hold the line with their flesh.

  36. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    May 27, 2015 at 2:03 pm

    The cargo cult is getting shameless by the day.

    As you can see, they now have started to argue that these dollars are not good for Iranians at all. It makes Iranian stomach upset. As the author shamelessly writes these dollars should be invested in Qatar LNG project so that they can steal more of Iran’s gas share.

    I guess me, Mr Fyi and you are the only ones left who are arguing for money to be invested in startups, technology incubators, research and development.

    The rest are battling whether more moneys should be invested in Dubai, Europe and even Qatar or whether to use it to prop up useless toman and import more Ferraris, Chinese makeup kits for Tehrani boys and even the kotex.

  37. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 27, 2015 at 2:24 pm

    On second thought, from whom they are going to buy these tanks? Who is going to sell them even the watered down monkey versions? Enemy is the gate and now these commanders have remembered they need tanks?

    I mean it is ridiculous. Beyond belief.

  38. Smith says:

    “Human talent is at present the most scarce and the most valuable resource for creating wealth in a knowledge economy”

    Lee Kuan Yew

    Beat this one.

  39. Amir says:

    فقری بدتر از جهل نیست

    If we knew Emam Khnomeini had said all the things that we are saying now, and he has laid down the grand plan 37 years ago, and has done it infinite times more eloquently, AND that he hasn’t invented that by himself, but just reminded us (for a brief period of time) what اسلام ناب محمدی صلی الله علیه و آله truly meant, then I think everything looked very very different.

    If some of you think the Leader is a wise man and is after our national interests etc., think that he is following the path of Emam; if you think Emam was making a path, think that he was following the path of رسول الله صلی الله علیه و آله; and bear in mind that رسول الله صلی الله علیه و آله was leading people towards صراط مستقیم، للتی هی اقوم، towards God. Try to reach towards علت العلل. It’s hard, but Emam showed it’s quite possible, and we see the results already.

  40. Karl.. says:

    About FIFA “corruption”
    Now its likely that the Jordanian prince will take the FIFIA highest post! Hilarious.

  41. Karl.. says:

    Seems like only Russia do the hardwork for BRICS
    Russia propose BRICS prototype of SWIFT global system

  42. kooshy says:

    Delusionary Thinking in Washington
    The Desperate Plight of a Declining Superpower

    By Michael T. Klare

  43. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    May 28, 2015 at 10:09 pm

    I think Iran is producing – in the military industries – some types of diesel engines.

  44. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    May 28, 2015 at 9:38 pm

    Mr. Lee is correct in his observations about US and Europe.

    The fact of the matter is that no one outside of Western Europe and North America is as innovative as them across so many fields of human endeavor – not even the Japanese.

    I do not want to denigrate the Japanese; they only have been at this game for less than 150 years while France, for example, has been at it for 800 years.

  45. Ferri says:

    Kooshy says:

    May 28, 2015 at 6:34 pm

    Dear Kooshy thank you for your response. What I mean about the fact that many of us knew …. is basically due to the fact that we have been monitoring the US activities and demonization about Iran for years now. In my humble opinion the only deal that works for the US is Iran’s total capitulation. Discussion have started with the US under various Iranian Admins. but each time the US proved that it would not deliver on its end of the bargain. Mr. Rohani and Zarif were witnessed to this under the Khatami period when they stopped Iran’s nuclear program for 2 years, implemented the Additional Protocol though it was not ratified by the Majlis and we know what the end result of that discussion was. Yes, even under Ahmadinejad discussions took place – also recall how the US after requesting that Brazil and Turkey offer Iran swap deal within less than 24 hours after Iran’s acceptance the deal was reneged by the Obama Admin.

    All I am saying is that the US does not want a deal unless the deal is a “win” for one side. I also want to remind you, though I am sure you know this already – the Supreme Leader of Iran had said “No to military inspection of Iran’s nuclear sites, nor access to military inspectors; no to interview and discussion of Iran’s nuclear scientists or other researchers, etc.. ” I won’t even go into the details of how this current deal has basically stopped Iran’s R&D – remember Iran can only work on R1 not R2,R3,R4,R5,R8 etc.. this requires a detail technical discussion.

    The Additional protocol and “enhanced access” requires access to any military sites that the IAEA wants to inspect. Amano said this himself in his recent discussions. Do you think after the experience Iran has had with the IAEA Iran would open up its military facilities to the inspectors. In fact why should it?? These are Iran’s national security – which country in their right mind would allow this? Recall as well how many of Iran’s nuclear scientists were assassinated. In fact once again a list of nuclear scientists were provided to the Iranian Negotiating team – the negotiating team did not say no right off the bat – they took it to Iran and the Supreme Leader said no!

    One more critical factor sanctions relief: the mechanisms that the sanctions have been imposed are convoluted and quite ambiguous in their entirety. There is no such terminology as “nuclear related sanctions” – these sanctions come together under various combined categories (PMD, terrorism, human rights etc..) – a study was done showing how the Iranians would be blocked in their relief of a particular sanctions relief – i.e. if one is removed; then when it comes to implementation another one becomes the obstacle of the sanctions relief of even that particular item. Would be happy to provide the link for you though it is in Farsi.

    I am pro-discussion and I am pro-breaking the stalemate with the US – but when it comes to Iran’s national security, sovereignty, the security of its nationals, its economic advancement – I would want it safeguarded the same way we would want the same for the US. This deal as it currently stands does not have those provisions.

  46. Rehmat says:

    Netanyahu has been crying WOLF about Iran’s anti-Jewish bomb since 1990s. Israeli-born British author Gilad Atzmon had been wishing for years Netanyahu’s lies had come true.


  47. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 29, 2015 at 9:17 am

    Well it depends how you define the term produce. If buying the parts of some French engines from black market and assembling them in Iran to make just a few engines with “Iranian names” is production then yeah, Iran is indeed a producer of heavy diesel engines.

    The problem is not this. The problem is the adhoc way of doing things. Even the thinking is perceived as an adhoc activity let alone engines. Their world is not real. Everything is adhoc, until Kad-khoda accepts them again or the Boz-e-Akhshaf appears.

    There is no excuse for Iran not having advanced material research institutes capable of designing armor composition, not having mechanical engineering research institutes capable of designing internal combustion engines, not having precision and tooling research institute designing the tools necessary for industrial production etc etc etc.

    Why can’t a group of young, just graduating mechanical engineers walk into a bank/government office and get a loan/grant to build their startup company designing diesel engines? It happens in Germany. It happens in France. It happens in Sweden. Why not Iran?

  48. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 29, 2015 at 9:19 am

    It is exactly as you say. Japanese are just an exception. Out of the norm. That is why they have now been accepted as an honorary member of the West.

    Late Mr Yew had said that rising China unlike other emergent countries wants to remain China and be accepted as such and not as an honorary member of the West.

    Whether the Chinese will be able to pull it off, is yet to be seen. Because as you have also been saying for a long time, the Europeans are an exception in the universe. The rest are unthinking bio-organisms incapable of creativity. Even the Chinese.

  49. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    May 29, 2015 at 11:28 am

    You ask why it does not happen in Iran.

    Ultimately because Iran is not a serious inheritor of the Rationalist Greek Thought as exemplified by men such as Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Heraclitus, Xenophon and others.

    It was only sometime in 1370s when the complete works on Plato finally became available in Persian; for example.

    Even the current system of government in Iran owes its existence to one man – the late Mr. Khomeini – who was probably the sole living Rationalist Philosopher in the entire world of Islam at the time.

    The rest, Shia or Sunni, (like ISIS today) wanted us all to go and live in tents; just like the tribes of Arabia at the time of the Prophet.

    In regards to improvisation on building tanks and engines – I think that is an acceptable approach if one does not yet have the scientific and technological basis to do otherwise.

    What you mentioned about how Iranians combined different pieces of different systems into new tanks reminded me very much what Israelis were doing in 1940 and 1950; before they started stealing Western Technology or was outright given to them by others – illegally – to them.

    It is a start.

  50. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    May 29, 2015 at 11:35 am

    The sole Muslim country that has reached the “Middle Income Country” status is Turkey.

    Will Turkey muster enough creativity and spiritual energy to get herself out of that trap (most developing countries get stuck there) and move up, like the Japanese?

    I do not know but I rather doubt it.

  51. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 29, 2015 at 12:12 pm

    fyi says:
    May 29, 2015 at 12:15 pm

    Exactly. We are carrying the mass of ignorance of several centuries on our shoulders.

    I guess اسلام ناب محمدی means going back to the tents and tending to camels. It obviously does not have any tolerance for developing Artificial Intelligence or letting women choose their joorab va shalvar. I sometimes think if Mr Khomeini had not existed and the revolution had not happened, what would have happened to Iran now? Would have we seen emergence of a Shia Isis running around massacring people? The alternative world without Mr Khomeini in it, is really a scary one. In a way Mr. Khomeini did what Late Reza Shah desired but failed to do. Mr Khomeini secularized a religious nation, absolving it of their stupidity and irrationality by creating a perfect philosophical mirror in which they can see not the shadows in the cave but their real world outside.

    This is straight from the horse’s mouth (AKA there was/is nothing to be proud of):

    Part One: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6lXTHlbFIU

  52. Smith says:

    Depending on who defines the اسلام ناب محمدی , this is what it could mean: http://www.khabaronline.ir/detail/420804/weblog/jafarian

    Please note that, unless every one is not declared and accepted to be politically part and parcel of اسلام ناب محمدی even the Bahais and Qadianis, the bloodshed will continue.

    There will be no respite, otherwise.

  53. James Canning says:


    Japan wanted to surrender in May 1945 because obviously the war was lost.

  54. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    May 29, 2015 at 12:46 pm

    No doubt about it; without the late Mr. Khomeini the Akhbari guys would have created a Shia version of ISIS; there were many who admired Taliban.

    They were calling him, his children, and his wife ‘najis” when he taught in Qum; soley because he was also teaching Muslim Philosophy.

  55. Nasser says:

    Smith says: May 28, 2015 at 11:22 pm

    I greatly admired that man as did so many others. RIP. That is a beautiful quote I agree. As you have stated in the past, our problem isn’t that we don’t have a production line for airbuses, or bmws, or iphones. Our problem is that our social organization and conditions don’t allow for our people’s talents to flourish so that we can come up with such stuff on our own. Or at least, at the very least, copy the most vital stuff (decades old tech) that would allow us to sustain our way of life without reliance on other countries. Sad indeed.

  56. Nasser says:

    Smith says: May 28, 2015 at 10:15 pm

    Well it made my stomach churn just reading that article. Quite astonishing really. That’s the level of thought going on in the heads of Iran’s so called economists?! I expected better. I honestly used to read Mr Khajehpour’s article (and your and JoeP’s comments on them) before. While he didn’t seem like much of a visionary, at least he talked about ramping up production, which to my mind was at least an improvement. He used to talk about Iran’s plans to ramp up production of cement, steel, basic petro chemicals like plastic resins and fertilizer and some other mining projects. Even then I suppose one could see that is just construction and basic materials; we are literally taking minerals out of the ground and doing the minimal of processing and sending them overseas and calling it quits. So even for basic materials there is no mention of research in materials science, super alloys or any specialty chemicals. Never mind even addressing areas like microelectronics, machine tools, factory automation equipments and control systems, internal combustion engines and propulsion systems. Then again the man is supposed to be a financier and not an engineer with knowledge of industrial processes who would understand how these would then integrate together to form the crucial components for a genuine industrial base.

    Iran’s economic system is designed to enrich loyalists and insiders while placating a gullible population with handouts and perks and soothing propaganda. Clearly those are its priorities, it is not to foster genuine autarkic industrial growth, despite the pronouncements or wishes of its most senior authority. That is why it often seems to us that Iran is actually following the headless chicken school of economic theory. Just muddling along, hoping the Chinese or the Russians or the French or whoever will sell them a complete turn key production line for this or that, and after they have bought enough such turn key production lines they would become self sufficient. These are made to make sure that only insider mafias would end up with all wealth and power. It is not chaotic and ad hoc at all once you understand this. But at the same time it must placate its masses. It does this with subsidies and handouts, fake jobs (overstaffed bureaucracy), imported consumer goods (I call it opium), sky high interest rates (why bother starting a business when you can get Warren Buffet type returns just parking your money in a bank), and encouragement to engage in real estate speculation and financial shenanigans; and of course they dare not implement a real tax system. They have created a nation of dependents and naturally the corruption has become systemic and perpetuates itself. The rest is propaganda mostly; like the example you often cite of the Saudis parading their expired missiles, aimed at lulling a gullible population into thinking they are strong and progress is being made. That is why they put out complete systems like fighter planes when people know damn well that they have no means of producing the crucial components of such systems. That is why the rest of the world laughs at the claims of the Iranian media; they are not isolated, they are not fooled. Showpiece solutions, no real solutions.

    You quite rightly ask why “a group of young, just graduating mechanical engineers walk into a bank/government office and get a loan/grant to build their startup company designing diesel engines?” Yeah precisely. Why can’t Iran make use of its graduating engineers and has to suffer such a brain drain? Funding, funding, funding. You know Iran has its own venture capitals. Its government has allocated some funding for internet start ups (which to them is what constitutes hi tech). They did this because they think this is cheaper than funding real industrial growth. They tried to have their own facebook, youtube, ebay; but the amount of money they have allocated to this is utterly laughable. A new tech venture in the West raises more money in three rounds of funding than the entire budget allocated to this entire sector for five years. Always looking for the easy fix, and like I said, showpiece solutions, no real solutions. You can’t tell me all those in government don’t understand the elementary basics of finance and growth. How can a venture be started without raising enough capital? Modern manufacturing and industrial research is expensive; it is not like starting a restaurant that all you need is your family savings to get started. And how can such expensive ventures grow and sustain itself without capturing a market? Iran is cut off from global finance and from global markets. Its own population of 80 million is not a huge market by itself. So the only way it can industrialize is if its government subsidies its industries on both ends; both by providing the start up capital and partially acting as a customer by awarding contracts. In other words its society must channel most of the available capital towards this goal. For this to happen they need to overhaul both their fiscal policies and their banking and financial policies. As you yourself have argued in the past their cities need to be run from property taxes not the oil income redistribution crap they do now. And don’t even get me started on 20something percent interest rates that ordinary people must pay to even get a loan. It is such a mess. But in my opinion, a deliberate mess.

    I would like to suggest something; if we could copy two things from the Chinese system right away, it would be one, to have actual engineers with real knowledge of industrial processes and technological cycles planning our budgets and economic policies rather than these akhunds or perhaps even worse these poorly educated humanities majors socialist idiots doing that job. And two, to have a mandatory retirement age of 65 for our leaders. Alas, as you said, if only wishes could come true.

  57. Nasser says:

    Smith says: May 29, 2015 at 11:35 am

    I very strongly disagree with that statement on China. Or Russia for that matter. These two countries, their people and their leadership understand the value of applied science and the real sources of national power. They will be fine. If anything Lee Kwan Yew and Singapore proved that the West has no monopoly on science and with proper leadership, a disciplined and hard working people can make progress in quick time.

    I usually hate Spengler’s polemics but I find these two articles by him to be quite insightful.



  58. Kooshy says:

    Ferri says:
    May 29, 2015 at 10:12 am
    Ferri thank you for your comment, I also never was optimistic that any deal can work, more importantly I don’t believe this deal or any deal with an Iran in her current independent posture will satisfies American’s strategic (hegemonic) plans for the region. Never less I agree with Iran’s national security decision makers that there is no harm exploring the other side and have a close encounter to understand what the other side wants and what tools she poses.

    One can learn a lot and report back to analyst on just the body language alone to find out from other side. To me as I have written here for many years the biggest danger to Iran is not the empty threat from US or her shity clients in Israel and KSA I always argued and I believe I am right to say the biggest threat that they unfortunately used is sectarian inter religion threat.

    That’s where we are now and we should talk to to see if they still believe they will win this phase of our 37 years struggle with the west.

    One thing is sure so far the other side has lost a lot more her regional allies and clients are in as much trouble as is Iran’s if not more. I don’t see the decision to negotiate as this administrations, I see this as a pre discussed Nezam decision after some nuclear achievements where they had convincing know how that would and could not have been taken back or blocked.

  59. Amir says:

    خب الحمدلله مفسرین اسلام ناب محمدی صلی الله علیه و آله اینجا زیاد هستند! به قول همون “آقای” خمینی (!) اخیراً آقای کارتر هم اسلام شناس شده اند

    All I’m saying is that today, after twenty-something years, all of us can see Emam was right. Now everyone is trying to put his words in Emam’s mouth; we have one of them going very strong for the last two decades (ehem… tajere baghe pesteh).

    All I’m saying is someone might say Emam secularized Iran (really?), or he was in fact a Soviet agent (Shah said that, if I’m not wrong), or he was an Indian (SAVAK widely promoted it), but there is one fool-proof way to find out; check out صحیفه نور. It’s 22 volumes, but you’ll get the hang of it soon.

    Another point is that after I have graduated and become more involved with the society I suddenly realized everyone is most acutely worried about materialistic aspects of life; that’s why critical thinking isn’t valued (as Mr Smith correctly stated, even thinking is ad hoc; I couldn’t put it more accurately) but also that’s why the elite can’t see past their nose.

    EVERY single opponent of meaningful progress and enlightenment is stuck in the “camel dilemma”:

    If you say we have to endure hardships to secure our independence some people would say “do you expect us to live in tents and ride camel”?
    If you say اسلام ناب محمدی صلی الله علیه و آله would guarantee our success, in addition to many other things, some would argue “what do you mean by that? Riding camel, for sure?”
    If you say Muslims should unite some would ask “with them camel-jockeys? Thanks but no thanks”
    If you say you are a Muslim, to an American, he/ she would ask “how are the camel?”

    The mentality of a dallal (who is riding an imported Ferrari or Porsche, and paying tithe, and organizing سفره حضرت ابوالفضل علیه السلام) at the same time, is very very unfortunately that of our West-oriented intellectual, and that of some of our teenage girls, and that of others who can read Farsi, but don’t use it to understand what Emam actually said (not what they want him to have said)…

    Camel-dilemma! Think about it!

  60. M. Ali says:


    As an Iranian, the only real thing that remains is, What are YOU doing?

  61. Rehmat says:

    On May 27, 2015, Dr. Tarita Parsi, an anti-Islamist regime in Tehran, and Paul Pillar, a former CIA analyst, co-authored an article, entitled “The Iran Talks Game Changer: An Israeli-Hizbullah War” has the footprints on this Israel-Cyprus conspiracy against Hizbullah.

    “There are signs Israel may be at war again this summer. This time, not with Hamas in Gaza but with Hizbullah in Lebanon. Such a war may be the result not only of spillover from the Syrian war or ongoing Israeli-Hizbullah tensions. The deciding factor may be an Israeli calculation that war will shift momentum in the US Congress decisively against the pending nuclear deal with Iran – a deal that critics say will increase Iran’s maneuverability in the region, including its support for Hizbullah,” Parsi-Pillar said.


  62. Jay says:

    Our host’s discussion of US and the house of Saud is but a subtext to the rampant and widespread corruption in Western societies. I don’t see a cure coming any time soon.

    On a related note, while I am cognizant of the societal, political, and cultural challenges that face Iran and Iranians in their quest for achievement, and I sympathize with the frustrations around trivialities that hinder progress on a day-to-day basis, I do find the prescriptions for using the “West” as a model to overcome these challenges rather naive and delusional. Of course, unless we are striving for more corruption!

    The level of corruption in current western societies is so extensive and pervasive that it is not clear to me why there is an almost religious belief that emulation of these cultural norms is the gateway to nirvana.

  63. fyi says:

    Jay says:

    May 30, 2015 at 1:11 pm

    Iran can adapt & adopt the 230-year old US bankruptcy law so that so many debtors. would not rot in jails in Iran.

    As though we are still living in a Dickensian novel….

    The banks in Iran can strive to be as those in Denmark.

    And once and for all Iranians can stop repeating this silly charade of “Al Qarz al Hasna” – a utopian undertaking that has failed all the time over the last 70 years.

  64. Jay says:

    fyi says:
    May 30, 2015 at 3:35 pm

    Yes, the bankruptcy law should be reformed, but to what?

    In the US, the law has gone through six major revisions, and multiple minor revisions, since the 1930s. Most of which has been to establish a balance between corruption of the “debtors”, “lenders”, and the government.

    It is easy to describe and agree on concepts – but, as is always the case, the devil is in the details. Do you have a detailed and specific proposal that fits the context and confines of the IRI legal system? I suspect not! And, it is my understanding that although several reforms have been proposed, there is a lot of work that needs to be done before the bankruptcy system can be overturned.

    There is a fundamental problem of governance – some of the causes are in the nature of the governed, and some in the nature of the governance. Every Iranian in a taxi cab has a solution – none that can be realistically implemented!

  65. Irshad says:

    Two questions: 1. Whats your prognosis after the Zarif-Kerry meeting today? A deal is likely?
    2. What do you think is so great of Imam Khomeini?
    Thank you

  66. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    May 30, 2015 at 3:35 pm

    They will not do that. In Iran extreme forms of corruption which are not seen or even can be imagined in Western world have taken deep roots. I mean in which Western country you can think of, the government funding for setting up human blood derived medicines are diverted to enrich private pockets and children’s lives getting sabotaged? Only in Iran. Obviously not in Sweden.

    For instance in Sweden, they do not put people in prison and throw away the key because someone tried to establish a business and failed. In Iran the bank rules the masses. The bank puts people in prison and throws away the key. In Sweden people rule the banks. The banks have to work for the people not against them. If a member of public repeatedly fails in succeeding in his/her business and is incompetent with the loan entrusted to him/her, instead of putting him/her in prison they have something called credit score which they put to good use. This encourages people to be trustworthy and honest, causing their society and economy to be rich and functioning.

    In Iran the system encourages the public to become dishonest (in street parlance “zerang”). The successful bunch among these zerang guys then, after they have made huge amounts of corruption and hording tonnes of public money, have the audacity to point finger at West and criticize West while they themselves or their families live in the West and use all Western invention and innovations.

    Absolutely no shame at all. The small time guy in Iran, who fails to pay his loan back because his business failed has to rot in prison while the big sharks and the banks get away with billions in Iran. This is justice in their view. The American system in which a guy can say to a bank: “I am bankrupt” and be protected by law against banker gangs, is deemed as “corruption” by these shameless bunch who hide themselves behind semantics and “devil in the detail”. Absolutely no shame. Absolutely no honesty. Absolutely no compassion.

    Even Charles Dickens can not turn these into humans. They are something else. Unfortunately.

  67. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    May 29, 2015 at 4:00 pm

    Let’s hope I am wrong on that. Of course you are right that compared to Iran, those nations have understood these matters.

    But to tell you the truth, I am not seeing that vigor, that libre, that passion and that courage which causes individuals of a nation to push the boundaries and become creative.

    Yes, they can build and imitate and even occasionally synthesize new things, but that is about it.

    Again let’s hope I am proven wrong.

  68. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    May 29, 2015 at 3:37 pm

    The problem is actually even deeper than social organization and external conditions. Something is wrong with individuals. They are retarded (I can’t think of any other word to explain their misery).

    Let me give you an example. In almost all non-Western societies, iron deficiency anemia is quite common specially among women and children due to poor diet. In Children because they are growing fast and in women because of menstrual blood loss and pregnancy. Iran is no exception. Neither is China or South Asia or Africa. A community of about 3.5 billion humans are at risk specially the women and children.

    You might think that this condition was discovered, researched and treatments for it were made in Iran and Africa. Wrong. All these were done in West. But it did not end there for West.

    You see still this suffering is continuing despite the availability of treatment by ferrous sulfate tablets, since rural communities do not have access to medical facilities which can diagnose the problem and the cost of medical intervention and treatment can be too much for alot of inhabitants of these unthinking communities. Beside how long can a tablet supplement regime with its unpleasantness continue while it is essentially a dietary problem.

    You might think one of these 3.5 billion people probably is thinking about a solution for this problem which has its origin in diet. That one of these 3.5 billion at risk of suffering iron deficiency anemia is thinking about a solution that is workable and effective. Wrong. These are unthinking masses. They are retarded. They are useless.

    So where such a solution comes from? Of course from the West. No doubt about that. Not from Iran, not from China and certainly not from Africa.

    You see a young Canadian student has more innovation and brain power than the entire medical and non-community of these 3.5 billion people including Iran’s.

    It is a Canadian student that comes up with the idea of throwing in a piece of iron into the cooking pot and let the iron get dissolved in food and enrich it. He makes this piece of iron in the shape of a fish and calls it lucky: http://www.luckyironfish.com/

    There lies the root of our problem. The West had already given us the knowledge about iron deficiency anemia. The West had already told us about the treatment. The West had already done research about enriching food by cooking it in cast iron pots. But still it took a Western student to put 2+2 together and work it out for these retards.

    What can I say.

  69. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    May 29, 2015 at 3:54 pm

    Unfortunately you won’t see any of those issues rectified. We are dealing with a comatosed nation.

    I want to give another example here about why all the blame has to rest with the nation. This retarded nation.

    We know that Iran is not a liberal democracy which is alright. But Iran has a representative governance structure. So let’s see what we can learn about this nation from their choices of governance in the past two decades.

    If you look at the list of presidential candidates over the past two decades, and looking at the economic plans, you will find a very interesting point. That when given a chance the people of Iran, the public and this mellat have chosen the candidate whose economic plan called for least thinking, least work and had the most potential for moft-khordan. This is the people of Iran making their choice. Loud and clear.

    Now I am not here vouching for any candidate. For me all of them are crap. My discussion is academic, just to make my point that it is the individuals of a society who are retarded, and thus society as a whole is the way it is.

    In these elections of the past two decades, people elected those whose economic plan were:

    1- Development by leh kardan mellat specially the “mostaza’afin”. Har ki zerang bood. Whatever that means. People voted in huge numbers.

    2- Redistribution of oil money and bringing it to sofreh mardom. People voted in huge numbers.

    3- Tightening the belt until Kadkhoda orders otherwise. People voted in huge numbers.

    You might think, people did not have any other choice. Wrong. They did.

    For example take the economic plan of Mohsen Rezaee of turning Iran into an economic federation. The plan was sound. It would have structurally destroyed all the mafias and cults. If correctly employed such a system could have propelled Iran into an era of double digit economic growth since all the pre-requisites of such a growth already are present (namely young educated population, availability of raw resources, internal stability etc etc).

    Right now the town of Hasan Abad gets its economic planning from Tehran. As do all other towns, cities and regions from Hossein Abad to Kachal Abad. A fat corrupt and extremely ruthless planner in Tehran decides what people of Kachal Abad should do and how their future should look like. This causes huge amount of corruption, since this super-corruption is already planned to happen in gigantic proportions. It is part of the economic planning of the country. And it is the law.

    Now the Rezaee’s plan was quite revolutionary for Iran since it would have turned Iran in economic planning terms, into something like Germany or Canada. With each federation unit being in charge of its own planning and implementation of that plan. For example the people of kachal abad exactly know about their capabilities, resources, aspirations etc etc. The central government would only advise them and give them the funds. What they do with it will be entirely their business, whether they want to build roads, or build a food processing factory or invest in modern irrigation.

    Such a system would have put people in-charge of their economic future. Similar systems of economic planning runs United States, Canada and most of European countries. The central governments usually just issue grants and funds, implementing regulatory laws such as environment, workers’ rights, consumer protection etc and advises about economic conditions in future. The decision about what should be done is entirely upto the people of the federation unit.

    You might ask why people did not vote for him then?

    Answer is simple. People are retarded. These are not Western people who can rationally decide their own fate. These people are part and parcel of the cult. They are not separate from it. They love to be moft-khor. The next presidential candidate is going to give them another promise which will be something on the terms of moft-khori and the people will vote again in huge numbers.

    The voice of rationality has no place in an unthinking society no matter how well meaning it is. As you can see for yourself on this very discussion board.

    This is another reason why democracy can not work in irrational societies. Since irrational people can not decide what is best for them. They need a benevolent dictatorial system guiding them to success. Like the China’s.

  70. fyi says:

    Irshad says:

    May 30, 2015 at 5:01 pm

    To your first question: “Business as usual!” – Americans – perhaps to satisfy this or that Cat & Dog (say Saudi Arabia and France) tried to get more out of Iran. Iranians said no and now Americans can go back and report to the Cats and Dogs that “we tried and asked but could not wring that one out of them.”

    Fundamental contribution of the late Mr. Khomeini was this – in my opinion – he amalgamated the Principles of Democratic Republicanism and the Principles of Islam as thus resolved the problem of Legitimacy that has been plaguing Islamic world which began with the assassination of Imam Ali, continued to through with the Abbasid Caliphate and its destruction by Mongols, and then through the demise of the pretender to Caliphate – the Ottoman Padishah.

    Among the ingredients of this resolution was the Absolute Rule of the Supreme Jurist on the Rulings of Islam – that he could – per the Reason of (Islamic State) suspend them indefinitely (or in case of the Iranian system – delegate to an assembly such decisions).

  71. fyi says:

    Jay says:

    May 30, 2015 at 4:37 pm

    Here is a very simple solution:

    Set up a bankruptcy court system, appoint judges, and let them decide on how much creditors get – what percentage.

    And do not put the guy in prison for debt – that is just plain stupid – and to my knowledge it is done in every single Muslim country that you care to mention.

    Muslins may not be able to build jet engines, but they can at least do this much.

  72. Jay says:

    fyi says:
    May 30, 2015 at 8:48 pm

    I am sure you mean well, but your “solution” suggests that you are unfamiliar with the issues.

    For example, one of the the concerns that was addressed by the reform of bankruptcy laws in the US was abuse – a method of means testing was introduced and every debtor was no longer qualified for bankruptcy. This is just one issue highlighting the notion that simply appointing a judge to decide is a prescription for additional corruption.

    Over the years, there were also constitutional issues regarding the kind of appointment judges would receive and the kind of bankruptcy cases they would hear. Under the system of jurisprudence in Iran, it is not clear how the system may appropriate leniency and what may be appealed in such cases.

    Simply railing against “Muslim country” shortcomings and calling it stupid may help get the frustrations of your chest – and, I agree, as I said earlier, that the debt-credit system is an outdated paradigm in Iran. However, given my earlier agreement, it does not add constructively to the conversation.

    Restating my earlier statement — every taxicab passenger in Tehran has a solution to every problem, but I certainly hope that sanity prevails before any of them is implemented.

  73. Amir says:

    M. Ali says:
    May 30, 2015 at 10:10 am

    I’m not sure if I understood you correctly; maybe you are asking that in general, perhaps like “the thing that matters is what you are doing”.

    When I was a student I was just thinking about taking USMLE, preparing a resume, apply for a US visa and leave Iran forever and ever; no one remains the same. A LOT of events combined together and changed my whole perception of world and life and my belief system, I sure hope for better.

    I have decided to forgo continuing a clinician’s career and pursue a dedicated research path. This morning my father called me and blamed me for possibly the 10th time for being so stupid and rigid. He thinks I would lead a hand-to-mouth life, I’d regret my decision and I think 90 out of 100 people who go this way have ended up that way.

    The bottom line is I believe in God, I have accepted the after-life, I have heard he message of Emameyn Khomeini and Khamenei and I have decided to join the Scientific Jihad (or whatever that could be called). All is in God’s hand.

    But I believe one doesn’t have to radically change course to do one’s part; as the Leader has said, everyone should consider his or her present position as the center of the Islamic Republic, as the most important post, and do his or her best.

    Besides, I always liked what I have signed up for, so there goes that!

  74. M.Ali says:

    Amir, that’s all that matters at the end of the day. I get frustrated reading all the rants by certain posters here, complaining daily about what Iranians should do and giving off solutions like every football fun screaming at his team behind the TV screen.

    At the end of the day, its easy to scream that others are doing it wrong. It’s much harder to do something worthwhile ourselves. Like the fat, useless man watching football and complaining bitterly that team Melli is stupid and the coach is stupid and they are lazy and can’t score a simple goal.

    Iran has progressed year by year, not by people who sit in America and complain, but by Iranians like you and me. Maybe we are not the smartest or the most innovative but at least we are doing SOMETHING.

  75. Amir says:

    M.Ali says:
    May 31, 2015 at 2:13 am

    Thanks! خدا خیرت بده آقا جون هر کی هستی هر جا هستی

  76. Ferri says:

    It’s easy for us sitting in the West to discuss what’s wrong in Iran. It’s also unfair to totally disregard the advancements made in Iran and only hone in on negatives. If these suggestions are meant to be “constructive criticisms” with solutions – those solutions that some are providing cannot be provided in a vacuum. What has worked in the US, may not work for Sweden, and what has worked in Sweden may not suit the US – the same goes for Iran. If people, especially Iranians in the West really want to contribute to the advancement of Iran with their ideas than I would suggest that you spend some time in Iran, conduct a study accompanied by detailed research and analysis of the country, its economy, legal system, its financial/banking sectors; private and public sectors and then draft a proposal. Take one segment and come up with a proposal taking into consideration the best concepts from different countries and customize it for Iran.

    I for one am proud to see how much they have accomplished on their own without the help of those of us sitting in the West. Yes, there are significant problems that need to be corrected/modified/changed, just like any other country some more and some less. However, Iran has a strong foundation upon which one can build a sustainable economic model. Change doesn’t take place over night but reforms can be made gradually.

  77. fyi says:

    Jay says:

    May 30, 2015 at 11:25 pm

    You are excusing the inexcusable.

    This is like medicine; someone in the West has discovered how to deal with breech birth or ectopic pregnancy.

    One has the duty to the pregnant women so afflicted to learn and implement those solutions as soon as possible.

    You take several years of a man’s life, putting him behind bars because of his debts – you have wasted his life and harmed the society as well.

    You know somewhere else they have developed legal methods to deal with such situations.

    And since you belong to backward country, your most efficient course of action is to learn, adapt, and implement.

  78. Sammy says:

    By Ziad Fadel , a true Syrian patriot.


    …So much talk these days about the West concocting new plans to divvy up the Near East. The term “Near East” suggests imperialism, as it should. After all, there is the near one, the middle one and the far one, all expressions made up by the English and French to describe their dominions in Asia. The closest part is, of course, Western Asia where you find Syria and Iraq. There is a middle part, once called the Middle East to refer to Afghanistan all the way to East India, and, there is a far part, way over on the Pacific Ocean which is appropriately called the Far East. Get it? It’s all very neat, just like a Britons’s public life. All discipline and protocol. But, it’s also like a Briton’s private life in the way it unfolds – sado-masochism, cross-dressing, boy-buggery and a good episode with the oak switch to keep the young lads keen.
    There are two reasons why the West is obsessed with partition:
    1. Dr. Bashar Al-Ja’afari said it several times in speeches – twice here in Michigan. He minced no words. Zionism needs new political states based on religious identity in order to justify the Zionist Entity’s existence as a Jewish State;
    2. The U.S. and its Arabian Wahhabist “allies” want to stop the gas pipeline through Iraq to Syria and break the Fatimid Crescent extending from its main beneficiary, Iran.
    The first postulate justifies the Zionist insistence that their ghetto state which was built on the flesh and bones of the indigenous people of Southern Syria (Palestine) by foreigners from Eastern Europe be declared “Jewish”. That their counterfeit nation is surrounded by other nations which identify themselves by religion confirms their bigoted philosophy.
    The second postulate simply creates areas where Iran cannot expand, such as the central Iraqi desert bordering Syria – exactly the area through which the pipeline is to be built for transit to Syrian ports. Such an area would be declared Sunni and, ergo, anti-Shi’I, anti-Iran. Or so the U.S. seems to think……

  79. Jay says:

    fyi says:
    May 31, 2015 at 9:45 am

    I am not excusing anything! I believe the legal system must address the “debt” issue .

    What I am saying is that trivializing the solution and suggesting simplistic ideas does not lend credibility to your argument that you have a solution.

    It is a classical mistake to confound commitment to solving a problem with commitment to a solution!

  80. fyi says:

    Jay says:

    May 31, 2015 at 10:58 am

    What part of the solution eludes Iranian Majlis?

    Are the MPs committed to solving this problem? Let us hope so.

    Note that nothing has been done in over 60 years.

  81. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    If you had a clue you would know that Majlis passed a law two years ago ending jailing for debt.

    As usual talking out of your asses…

    Nasser-jan, it doesn’t take a genius to just repeat- as felani and felani do- what me and others said years ago on this forum, what Agha said 20 years and what Imam said 40 years ago. You know, just letting you know in case you missed out the first time around…

    The point is that felani didn’t get it 40 years ago when Imam was saying it then- not only did he not get it- he arrogantly walked away so as not to “waste his life”. His new found faith in what Imam said so many years ago be darde felane amash mikhore. Ditto felani and Agha today.

    Enjoy the circle jerking…

  82. fyi says:


    Number of debtor prisoners in Iran:


    11,000 or more or less

  83. fyi says:



    Note that the notion of “bankruptcy” and “Debt Liquidation” is not entertained.

    The fact of the matter is that there are 3 kinds of Innovations:

    Legal, Process, and Product.

    All of them have to be attempted at all times.

  84. fyi says:


    On the role of State and Family


  85. M.Ali says:

    Can you folks focus on geopolitical matter? For the past couple of yearss, we have to keep being distracted by rants by the three wise men about how Iranians should stop importing iPhone covers and build combustion engines, and I don’t think the focus of this site is called Lessons From the Armchair Diaspora.

    I bet everyone comes to this site for discussions regarding America-Iran politics so why not be respectful to the hosts and their visitors and stay on topic?

  86. kooshy says:

    M.Ali says:
    May 31, 2015 at 5:08 pm

    The Trios Zios (FYI, and his two warmup acts have nothing to offer or discuss when it comes to geopolitics of Iran and their adopted country of interest, they are not here or interested in geopolitics, as by now everyone who visits this site knows, they are here to demonize Iran and not to praise it’s achievements or to have a realistic, constructive debate of her problems. To me the best way to counter these Zios is to let them thank each other for their own comments, like what was happening last few days before Jay replied to his simplistic solution to a civil law. Again as I have told them before as long as they are not being nasty with regard to Iran and Iranian’s culture, religion and way of life, they can thank each other’s comments as much as they want. That’s, If they don’t want the Zionism and shity life of Israelis to come up again for discussion on this site.

  87. M.Ali says:

    That’s what I’ve been. I’ve decided to ignore it but they have more or less ruined the site. I come to this website, see 100 comments and get excites to this what up to date discussions are being had. Is it about the negotiations? Is it about Iraq or Syria war with Daesh? What’s new King Salman’s and his boy prince strategy regarding Iran and Yemen? What will be the impact of Morsi’s death sentence? Is Pakistan’s refusal to provide soldiers to Saudi for Yemen war indicating a new era of Pakistani refusal of Arab dictation? What is Turkey’s role in the ever changing Middle East? Are China and Russia still staying away from Middle Eastern issues? What will Daesh’s role in Saudi be after we saw two attacks against the shia in a week? Is the Shia militant groups in Iraq and Syria winning hurts and minds of non-shias?

    No. It’s like being stuck in a taxi while the taxi driver gives you microwave solutions to all Iran’s problems if only the stupid people just took his advise.

  88. BiBiJon says:

    M.Ali says:
    May 31, 2015 at 6:04 pm

    about the negotiations?

    Originally both sides claimed they couldn’t discuss anything until and unless the nuclear file was closed. It turns out that was a ruse. The whole point seems to have been lets just talk, and let everyone see and get used to us talking together, professionally, and let the world see the two sides talk confidentially. The main goal has been largely achieved judging by how disorienting the spectacle has been for the neocons.

    What I see coming down the pike: Negotiations will fail to produce a comprehensive accord. However, Iran will sign the AP, and sign a contract with Russia to receive Iranian LEU and supply reactor fuel. In response, US will stop implementing some sanctions which in turn will open up the floodgates to investment monies. By January 2016, Samantha Power will abstain from a motion to annul previous UNSC resolutions against Iran. All of this will happen without a formal deal which no matter how it was worded would have been very difficult to defend in both Iran and the US.

    I was first confused why Obama did not defend Iran against the worst hysterical neocon slanders. But, now I see the method. He is using the neocon arguments as justification for establishing diplomatic channels to Iran. Obama is saying precisely because Iran is as scary as necons would have us believe, all the more reason to have deals; to deal you need to negotiate and to negotiate means you got to have a diplomatic channel. Talk about dipping your stick in the neocon’s toilet before beating them about the head with that soiled stick.

    about Iraq or Syria war with Daesh?

    I surmise the strategy to be to play to Daesh’s weak point: overstretch. As the Syrian Arab Army and Iraqi army/militia retreat, they create uncontested territory for Daesh which stretches their lines of communication, logistics, and hampers their ability to mass fighters. The strategy has other dividends: rest for security forces, regrouping, and letting the locals get a full taste of being ruled by bunch of fanatical foreigners.

    What’s new King Salman’s and his boy prince strategy regarding Iran and Yemen?

    I see the Saudis just as disoriented as the neocons. Stupid is what stupid does. Iran’s only risk is if she runs out of popcorn.

    What will be the impact of Morsi’s death sentence?

    Drive MB underground, and prod it into violence which will sooner than later also have nasty reverberations for the anti-MB Saudis.

    Is Pakistan’s refusal to provide soldiers to Saudi for Yemen war indicating a new era of Pakistani refusal of Arab dictation?

    Not sure Pakistan sees beyond not wanting to entangle itself in an harebrained scheme. What made Pakistan realize it was harebrained, was the way they were asked/told to help. And, then confirmation came when they got their public expressions of anger from the PGCC countries. Note to Saudis and other shake Ya’booties: Ask privately, and receive a response privately in the future if you are lucky enough to have a future.

    What is Turkey’s role in the ever changing Middle East?

    Turkey has tied her own political stabilize to Assad’s fate. An entirely unnecessary risk. They are bound to see the light as soon as the Syria Arab Army has had sufficient rest.

    Are China and Russia still staying away from Middle Eastern issues?

    China and Russia are laughing all the way into each others’ arms. Other than keeping Syria and Iran afloat, there’s no compelling reason for them to get further involved.

    What will Daesh’s role in Saudi be after we saw two attacks against the shia in a week?

    Spread mayhem. This is only the beginning of an unwinnable situation for the Saudis. They either make some effort in protecting the Shii and get the wrath of Daesh, or do nothing and cause a full bore revolt by the Shii.

    Is the Shia militant groups in Iraq and Syria winning hurts and minds of non-shias?

    Judging by the baseless accusations of revenge and looting in the western media, then I have to assume the answer is ‘yes,’ and it is driving the neocon press crazy.

    What do you and others think?

  89. Jay says:

    BiBiJon says:
    May 31, 2015 at 9:04 pm

    Fascinating observations!

    I do not believe in the neocon vs. non-neocon camp in the sense that most people do. I would suggest that the US strategy is to play all sides – including Iran. And, I would surmise that Iran’s political apparatus is aware of this.

    King Salman’s hands is dirty – I believe Saudi’s are complicit in the attacks on Shia. Fear can yield submission – just look at the US! I think this strategy will backfire badly on the disoriented house of Saud.

  90. kooshy says:

    “Is the Shia militant groups in Iraq and Syria winning hurts and minds of non-shias?

    Judging by the baseless accusations of revenge and looting in the western media, then I have to assume the answer is ‘yes,’ and it is driving the neocon press crazy.”

    I agree, at the minimum the Iraqi shieh lead government, and the shieh militias have been asked by the Sunni tribes to come to their rescue and protect them from the Sunni extremists supported by KSA and US and her European clients. Just like attacking Iraq and losing it, this could not have happened without stupidity of US and KSA and Europeans.

    Thank you and Ali for constructive, discussion on geopolitics of Iran, ME region, and US, as is related to this site.

  91. M.Ali says:

    Thanks Bibijon for your comments! It was a pleasure to read.

    Kooshy, regarding the shia militants, I’ve been reading that they have been recruiting young people from all sects and not just shia, but also Christians, etc.

  92. Bussed-in Basiji says:


    John broke his leg…Javad has lower-back pain…Iran will not sign the AP.

    Syria and Iraq situation:

    Before the fall of Ramadi Iraqi govt didn’t want Shia militias in al-Anbar and locals were scared of their presence. Today the locals are begging for the militias to come.

    Syrian army was getting tired and retreated to “regroup”. Expect a hot summer.

    Saudi-Yemen war:

    Saudi strategic blunder of Vietnam/Iraq proportions.

    Morsi-MB situation:

    Internal struggle in MB between pro and anti Iran factions. Pro Iran faction will be victorious.

    Mosque attacks in Saudi:

    As reported by FT, Shias are forming self-defense militias in Saudi. Hallelujah.

  93. Bussed-in Basiji says:


    Currently no viable alternative to Sultan Recep aka “Stubborn Donkey”.


    Don’t ask…


    The flirtation/”reset” with west got nowhere. I predict strategic shift towrds Iran and China is permanent.

  94. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    On the topic of this thread:

    How can you get out of the bed when the person you are in bed with has a nice, firm grip on your balls?

    The problem is dollar value now being based to a large extent on Saudi denomination of its crude oil sales in US dollars.

    What would happen if US ended relationship with Saudi and precipiated a collapse of dollar value?

    Figure that one out and you’ll have your solution.

  95. Amir says:

    I was just thinking, Emam used to say if one day our enemies start to praise us we must doubt our very actions and question ourselves seriously.

    I thought seculars and liberals (and most certainly people who think religion is a useful superstition at best معاذا بالله)* couldn’t “swallow” Emam the way he was, so they probably can’t do it now either.
    The answer? They distort Emam; instead of accepting what he said, making Emam mouth their words.
    Sounds impossible? Ask Ostad-al-asaatid … ehem … haj agha khatere (aka tajere varshekasteye baghe pesteh).

    Those marked by an asterisk are the most peculiar ones; if they concede religion can indeed provide a viable system (which means it isn’t a relic of the past, limited to 6th century Arabia), their whole charade of Rationalism would collapse; but they can’t deny that it apparently does exactly that.

    Solution? Religion isn’t in fact religion. Emam wasn’t a jurist; he was in fact someone like Reza khan (!). He was a bio technician, or an engineer dressed up as a jurist [for an added measure, the British could be added, they pull all threads. And the Aliens, too!]

    Sounds bizarre? Yes it does! Impossible to think that way? Not anymore.

  96. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says:

    May 31, 2015 at 9:04 pm

    Additional Protocol had been signed by Mr. Khatami’s Government and was being implemented until P5 decided to take Iran to UNSC.

    Under any deal, Iran will resume implementing AP but Majlis will not ratify it.

    Saudi Arabia was expecting that her bombardment of Yemen would provoke Houthis to attack Saudi Arabia – in which case the cry of “Islam is in danger” would have been raised and Egypt and Pakistan would have them have ample coverage to come to the aide of Saudi Arabia lest the Ka’aba and the Al Masjid Al Nabi be destroyed by the Godless Houthis.

    Houthis, instead, concentrated on conquering the rest of Yemen and the elimination of their enemies. The provocations of the Saudi Air Force, fully supported by US, did not cause them to lose site of what was important – creation of the fact on the ground.

    Saudis, ultimately, want to breakup Yemen again; Iranians want to keep it together.

    ISIS/DAESH is not going to over-stretch its lines of control and communication; she is not going to implode. She is being aided by EU and Turkey in as much as there is no effort in destroying her finances. By that I mean there is no effort that I am aware of based on publicly available news that indicates economic war being waged by Axis Powers against it. Far from it. Nothing like the effort to destroy Iran has been directed at ISIS.

    ISIS is a new country and must be so accepted; Iran and Syria and Iraq do not have the resources to go and crush the will of these Jihadists and the population that supports them to resist.

    In fact, it seems to me, that the Syrian government is consolidating to the West of the Syrian Desert. The losers are Kurds who are now going to be surrounded in a sea of Jihadists as Syrian state withdraws.

    Once ISIS moves South and West against Jordan, then we might see Axis Powers actually trying to fight ISIS in earnest. But perhaps not even then, since they have long identified the Shia as the Manichean Evil-doers.

    Furthermore, they need ISIS, or so they think, to put pressure on Iran.

    The fact of the matter is that we have a situation that thousands of martyrdom-seeking Sunni youth have identified Shia as the enemy of God and Islam. This fact must be faced as these young people enter Shia mosques in various countries (Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia…) and blow themselves up.

    One must assume that ISIS-like ideas and groups will spread in every Muslim country and prepare accordingly.

    If and when ISIS destroy also the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, she will gain Sunni Muslim legitimacy and war against it will be almost impossible.

  97. James Canning says:


    Your initial post on this thread claims the British Foreign Office “established the monarchy” of Saudi Arabia. This is nonsense.

  98. Kooshy says:

    Contrary to what our resident zio’ talking point says, and much like what IRI’ official position is, Daesh is not an state or Islamic.
    To be a governing state Is not enough to just hold a territory with foreign financial and logistic support, if they were able to govern and produce and provide services, for sure by now they would gotten recognized by U.S. EU, Erdogan and Israel, ( in beginning of Syria war US and Europe tried didn’t work) Daesh doesn’t have the capacity and legitimacy for her occupies to govern, much like Israel they are an occupying foreign entity with financial and military help of western powers and her regional clients. When this zio, FYI can explain to you
    how Daesh can and would provide mail service or medical services for her unfortunate occupied then he can claim Daesh is a state and should be recognized by Iran.
    This zio , hopes he can intensify the animosity of Shieh and Sunni, so may be his adopted entity can survive longer under an ongoing interfaith war.
    Thanks god for thoughtful Shieh leaders of MD, so far Iran and her regional allies have not bite the zio’ bate.
    But, IMO luck is not going to be with the zios ,like what Bibijan wrote I believe eventually the clashes on eastern KSA will intensify and will further destabilize the kingdom ,ultimately this will effect and destabilize, Jordan and Egypt, both these states are pillars of security for Israel paid by KSA, under the old carter era regional security architecture.

    This US planed system, a security architecture for eastern Mediterranean is what we are witnessing, is collapsing and U.S. hope is to shift the Muslim street 60 years priority and mentality of Muslims against occupying Israel war, to a war and mentality of Sunni Muslim against Shieh Muslim on the old British used regional fault line, hoping interfaith war will keep them away from her much weaker and much less populated clients, in Palestine.

  99. Kooshy says:

    fyi says:
    June 1, 2015 at 6:15 pm

    From the Washington Institute for Middle East Policy:”

    Really, Welcome home to Washington Institute for Middle East Policy, any news from MEMRI you can share, beside the usual BS you share with your warmup acts.

  100. Rehmat says:

    James Canning – Your knowledge about European history is just B.s, which I have proved on some other White supremacist website which you visit regularly.


  101. kooshy says:

    For years on this site RSH, and later on Zio FYI [as he opted agreeing with RSH’ archaic and Arcadeiac (intensified version of believing too much in Rambo video game) opinion] predicting (you read hoping) US will attack Iran soon, that all was talking from their asses as their usual nonsense comments on this blog.

    News / Middle East

    Obama: No Military Answer to Iran’s Nuclear Program

  102. Paul says:

    According to this …


    … the impending Iran deal is precisely the complete surrender by Iran that it smells like, led by the elements in Iran that have long longed for US hegemony over Iran.

  103. kooshy says:

    If you haven’t read it yet,

    “Iran Breaks New Ground In Iraq”

    By Mahan Abedin

    “The loss of Ramadi in Iraq’s restive Anbar province has been widely perceived as foremost a failure of US policy in Iraq. Whilst high-ranking US officials tried to deflect the blame onto Iraqi forces, America’s confused and half-hearted strategy against the Islamic State (IS) has come into sharp relief.

    By contrast, Iran’s parallel campaign against IS has received a shot in the arms, as evidenced by the entry of Shiite-led militias into the Anbar arena.

    In Iraq the failure of the American- and British-trained army is by definition a victory for Iran, which has quietly developed an effective fighting force in the form of militias and special groups.”

  104. fyi says:

    Paul says:

    June 2, 2015 at 9:24 am

    Early in 2012, when it became clear to Axis Powers that Iran was not buckling under the EU sanctions and economic war, Mr. Obama instigated a crisis with Iran that in a short few weeks would have led to war.

    I am not sure what his motivations were; hoping to get Iranians to surrender by frightening them?

    What happened, however, was that Iranians stated that they are ready for war. Furthermore, the Russian Federation publicly stated that an attack on Iran would be considered as an attack on the vital interests of the Russian Federation.

    In 2012 in Iran, in 2013 in Syria, and in 2015 in Ukraine, Axis Powers had to beat a hasty retreat from War-is-Cheap policy.

    [In fairness, I think the War-is-cheap policy came from the Court of the Mad King. In Ukraine, in 2015, the French Duke and the German Duchess flew to Minsk and made a deal with the Prince of Muscovy – and they kept the Mad King away.

    But those not before the Prince of Muscovy had explicitly mentioned nuclear weapons.

    And in 2013, over Syria, the English peasants revolted and the Duke of Angel-Land could not move against the peasant in the Commons.]

    I think Mr. Obama is trying to get Iranians to agree to terms that in the future could be used to re-start a chain of accusations and innuendo that could be used to lead to war.

    Iranians should not agree to such terms and be ready to walk away.

    On the other hand, if the issue is of marginal import, the Iranians should sign and move on.

    I cannot judge what is going on exactly.

  105. pragmatic says:

    Most of your comments (from either side) are pure delusional. Some of you really think that you are working in Iran’s foreign ministry or US state department, or they are reading your comments!

    For those of you that think living in Iran is rosy, I advise you to go there and stay for a year and you’ll see how bad everything is, including the culture, which is a disaster, in every aspect you could imagine!

    The question, is why the great people of Iran have to pay for so long for the wrong decision makings of their politicians? Thank God we don’t have Ahmadnejad in power. A pure populist. Most of the issues we are facing today are his and his teams fault.

    I laugh at those Iranians who are sitting in London, Paris and NY and write comments here. Rest assured they have their cold beer and pistachios are on their side while they are writing their ARAJEEF (BS). You don’t know shit about the culture and what is going on in Iran. The issue is not the nuclear it’s the Iranian youth that are mostly unemployed or a drug addict. Why you geniuses don’t talk about the middle-class that is decreasing in number every month. Talk about the poverty. Talk about the corruption, talk about the women and the girls who sell their body to make the ends meat! Do you know that everyone is trying to cheat the other to earn a living! It’s a catastrophe.

    Hegemony! Hegemony, fuck this shit, how about the kids that are selling tissues in the streets rather than being in school. How about those kids that play tonbak in buses to earn a living! I am so sick of you that are having fun overseas and write solutions for us living in Iran. You are so adamant in not giving a bit in their negotiations with 5+1. Because we lose our hegemony! You have lost it within your own people.

    Lately in here we see that one claps and thanks the other one for the good comment! Comment this! Or I second your opinion, second this! Losers!

    We need peace, we need a better economy, we need jobs, we need work in other major and non-major cities.

    I’m out!

  106. pragmatic says:

    Most of your comments (from either side) are pure delusional. Some of you really think that you are working in Iran’s foreign ministry or US state department, or they are reading your comments!

    For those of you that think living in Iran is rosy, I advise you to go there and stay for a year and you’ll see how bad everything is, including the culture, which is a disaster, in every aspect you could imagine!

    The question, is why the great people of Iran have to pay for so long for the wrong decision makings of their politicians? Thank God we don’t have Ahmadnejad in power. A pure populist. Most of the issues we are facing today are his and his teams fault. Do you remember the day he said Tahrimha faght ye mosht kaghaz pareast!

    I laugh at those Iranians who are sitting in London, Paris and NY and write comments here. Rest assured they have their cold beer and pistachios on their side while they are writing their ARAJEEF (BS). You don’t know shit about the culture and what is going on in Iran. The issue is not the nuclear it’s the Iranian youth that are mostly unemployed or a drug addict. Why you geniuses don’t talk about the middle-class that is decreasing in number every month. Talk about the poverty. Talk about the corruption, talk about the women and the girls who sell their body to make the ends meat! Do you know that everyone is trying to cheat the other to earn a living! It’s a catastrophe.

    Hegemony! Hegemony, fuck this shit, how about the kids that are selling tissues in the streets rather than being in school. I am so sick and tired of you that are having fun overseas and write solutions for us living in Iran. You are so adamant in not giving a bit in our negotiations with 5+1. Because we lose our hegemony! You have lost it within your own people.

    Lately in here we see that one claps and thanks the other one for the good comment! Comment this! Or I second your opinion, second this! Losers!

    We need peace, we need a better economy, we need jobs, we need work in other major and non-major cities.

    I’m out!

  107. fyi says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 2, 2015 at 11:17 am

    Like very many other Iranians and Muslims who comment here, you are impolite and cannot control your tongue.

    Americans and Europeans are superior.

    In regards to the “drug-addicted youth” – I am completely and thoroughly unsympathetic to them. If they have chosen to be drug users and drug addicts, it is their own personal moral choice.

    They cannot blame the Islamic Republic for that.

    If Iran is so bad, they can go to Pakistan, India, Afghanistan, and Turkey (this last one is interesting; Iranian youth begging for money….)

    As for the Middle Class and its sense of entitlement – I suggest you go to South Korea and see how hard the Korean people work – from almost cradle to grave.

    When Koreans look at Iranians, they wonder: “These people have so many natural resources; land, varied climate, minerals, oil – why are they not a first-rate country?”

    I assure you, it is not because of the Islamic Republic.

    And next time you want to insult an blame Dr. Ahmadinejad, tell us the name of the Iranian executive that you most admire – over the last 2500 years – whom you find superior to Mr. Ahmadinejad so that we know of your yard stick.

    And yet, be out of here and please close the door behind you.

  108. James Canning says:


    I take it you continue to claim that Britain established the monarchy in Saudi Arabia. Patent nonsense.

  109. James Canning says:


    You also claim I visit a “white supremacist” website. I am curious to know what that site is.

  110. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    From Associated Press:

    Secret FBI air force uses front companies for spying over U.S. cities


    Bill of Rights, my ass…

  111. Bussed-in Basiji says:


    Your English is suspiciously good for an Iranian living in Iran. Come on, you can tell us…

    Anyway, it appears you’re losing your shit cuz Hassan-joons and Javad-joons promise to “solve it in six months”- REMEMBER!- is turning into freakin nightmare, you know the kind where you and the guys you falsely put your hopes into are donkeys and you’re all stuck in sticky shit.

    Looks like the US doesn’t give a shit which sand-n****r is President in Iran…remember, to the Americans you’re a sand-n****r whose function in the world is to sell cheap oil and buy expansive US-made products so that you and all other Iranians will be “happy”…of course a s.n. that speaks English well…you know like Javad-joon.

    And also that whole “we need peace” b.s. comes from your fundamental misunderstanding of how nations interact. It’s called realism versus idealism, look it up.

  112. kooshy says:

    One wonders why so much hatred of president Ahmadinejad (from day one without even knowing him enough) exist, especially among Iranian diaspora and expatiates. Recently I heard from a hand banded green supporter of Mr. Mossavie ( without even knowing he was a former premier of Iran) that he saw President Ahmadinejad in a flight going back from visiting Turkey to Tehran, in regular Business class seat. He told me as he was passing to go to his seat, Mr. Ahmadinejad said hello to him but instead of returning fellow traveler’ pleasant gesture, he instead choose to turn his head away. Why, they are so personal on him? I think he is a good person and did plenty good for the country.

    When he first ran for office (and even a year after he won, summer of 06) I heard from Iranians who were Yazdi and obviously supporters of people from that part of country, which you know who they are, they were repeating a rumor that I was sure coming out of “laughing nuts” camp, blaming Dr. Sami’s death on Mr. Ahmadinejad trying to discredit him even before he got off on his job.

    The point is that supporters of current government even today they refuse to admit the negotiations with US even if materializes an agreement to a “happy ending” was instigated and started 6 months before the end of Dr. Ahmadinejad’s term ends meaning as Head of SNSC including Dr. Jalili with their approval and consent. Meaning these folks don’t want any credit to go to his administration for accepting Americans offer and starting to negotiate with them, ok, this is fine with me, in this case, is just fair, to take the blame if they slip or fail.

  113. kooshy says:

    On Personal note, I still watch Dr. Ahmadinejad’s interviews with Larry King, Charlie Rose, the incident with the asshole president of Columbia university, and so on, the reason is, that in the past I had never seen an interview with an Iranian politician in western media with that big of balls, saying so much truth in their faces.

  114. ordinary says:

    Pragmatic hang in there…

    Post the revolution, many devoted their life and heart and helped Iran to be where it is now (if we are to call them fuel), Ahmadinejad was the spark. In 8 years, he restored the tarnished Image and real standing of Iran to its best in centuries. Iran needs availability of steadfast leaders like Ahmadinejad to survive and superstar Ayatollahs like Khamenei to hold the bag or manage boundaries – without such individuals Iran is not massive enough to survive the currents.

    Few points:

    Sanctions shrinks the backbone of a country into rich and mostly poor.
    Every nation that worth its name has paid extremely high costs for independence.
    To give up is to accept perpetual struggle. To give up now is a unforgivable sin.

    Some individuals do better than others by luck and circumstance; as some are wiser or brighter.

    Our duty is to be useful to the cause of humanity in the way of God.
    Our hearts are with those that suffer and take the struggle.
    Our tears are for those kids and girls and adults. God forgives and helps those who fall short of other choices (let’s hope we forgive them too).

    We fall and get up, even in the best of countries. We fall off the straight path and try to climb back on it. People of God will not suffer for long. A person of God does not know suffering.

  115. Kooshy says:

    “We need peace, we need a better economy, we need jobs, we need work in other major and non-major cities.”

    Go thank god that in entire Western Asia you are in the only country that is experiencing peace and security all thanks to those Iranians you hate, if it wasn’t for them you would have lost the home and your Namoos you love so much Gone to Massod Jan or Al Baghdadi. Some westernized Iranians need make up their minds would they rather suck on American’ SOB clients, or on their own SOBs. There is no in between other rosy pre paid Utopias your are crying for.

  116. Rehmat says:

    The US-based Defense News reported on May 25, 2015 that Howard Kohr, chief executive officer of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), told US lawmakers that the US taxpayers may have to give $160 billion worth military aid to Israel during the 2017-2028 period to defend itself against a nuclear Iran.


  117. Rehmat says:

    James Canning – Your “curiosity” is no different than the “curiosity” which “killed the self-denying cat”.

  118. Rehmat says:

    kooshy – Below is a letter of gratitude from American Christian writer, author and Christian-Muslim interfaith activist, Mark Glenn:

    To–Dr. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, President of the Islamic Republic of Iran

    In the name of God, the compassionate, the merciful…

    Greetings Your Excellency, I pray that this finds you and your loved ones well, in good health and in God’s blessings.

    As I (we) write this, it is June 13, 2013, one day before elections are to begin in Iran where a new president will be chosen.

    To say that this is a bittersweet day for millions (billions?) of people around the globe is a great understatement Mr. President which I will try to explain now.

    As your Excellency may remember, I spoke at the gathering set up in your honor in New York City in September 2012 . I began my speech by personally thanking you on behalf of me, my wife and our children for being such a source of hope and inspiration to us these last 8 years.

    But I am sure, Mr. President–as much as I am sure that tomorrow follows today–that we are not alone in our appreciation for you and for all you have done for the cause of justice and truth over the last 8 years. As much as I know my own skin, I know there are people the world over–good people who have not been infected with this virus of evil that seem to have pervaded so much of the world these days–who are also reflecting on the importance of what today–your last day in office–represents to them in a very personal manner.

    In the Christian tradition, we read about how Jesus Christ said something which was as much a warning to His enemies as it was a source of hope to his friends and followers when He personally condemned the Jewish leadership of His own day by saying–

    “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town…’

    And indeed, Jesus Christ has made good on his promise Mr. President, by sending to a world without hope and a world being destroyed by the forces of organized evil prophets, sages and teachers such as you.

    Clearly, just as Jesus Christ–the man revered by Christians and Muslims alike–predicted, those seeking the path of God’s justice against the forces of organized evil have been killed, crucified, flogged in the synagogues and pursued from town to town. One need look no further than what has been done to the peoples of Palestine, Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and beyond to see that this has taken place, and at an incalculable level.

    More to the point however Mr. President, is that this is exactly how you and the great people of Iran have been treated by these organized forces of evil as well…You personally, but also your fellow Iranians, have been crucified, flogged in the synagogues of the evil doers and pursued from town to town in the court of public opinion, which these organized forces of evil possess through their control of the media. Just as they have for thousands of years defamed, mocked and slandered Jesus Christ and His message with the most scandalous, scurrilous and untrue statements in the interest of turning something that was wholesome and good into something profane, likewise have they done the same to you.

    Besides this, your own people have been killed through a campaign of terrorism that has resulted in the deaths of several of your scientists and great thinkers. The sanctions put on your country–meant to cause universal hardship and thus political unrest–are nothing short of overt acts of war against a peaceful, enlightened nation that has done nothing more than to fiercely assert her sovereignty, her independence and her devotion to the cause of what is right and just.

    And yet, throughout all of this, you, the Iranian people and the leadership of your country have stayed the course, maintained your dignity and your perseverance to the cause of truth and justice. Unlike what Israel and the West do on a daily basis, there have been no reprisals, no bombs going off or drone strikes by the Islamic Republic of Iran. Despite the fact that the countries that engage in the kind of aforementioned criminal behavior are soft targets that could easily be recipients of state sponsored violence against their people, nevertheless there have been no public assassinations or false flag attacks perpetrated by the Islamic Republic of Iran in the same fashion as Israel and the West engage on a daily basis.

    Rather, the response from both you the individual and Iran as a people to all of this has been calm, measured and rational, and in doing thus, you have provided what a war-weary humanity needs more than anything else right now–a beacon of light in the midst of unprecedented darkness and a stark contrast between the forces of good and those of evil.

    As your Excellency is aware, in the last century, but particularly in the last 10 years, the darkness that has enveloped the world has increased exponentially. As you have personally remarked in many of your speeches before the UN General Assembly, the promotion of war and the deliberate, concerted attack on religion, family, motherhood, the innocence of children and the basic moral threads necessary for any stable society to function have been traced back to the very same organized forces of evil whom Jesus Christ Himself condemned.

    And yet, in the face of what has been a ceaseless, seamless 8 year onslaught, you, Dr. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, President of the Islamic Republic of Iran, have stood fearlessly, speaking out loudly against these evils when very few world leaders would. The shame I felt in watching as our own American Congress stood 30 times in applause in honor of the gangster and war criminal Benjamin Netanyahu during one of his recent trips to the nation’s capital was only outdone by witnessing the embarrassing spectacle of what the Zionist controlled American media did to your good name and person when I was in New York for the occasion of speaking at your gathering.

    If only we had men such as you serving the interests of the people of the West rather than the elected and un-elected criminals and serpents who now prowl the halls of Congress, parliaments in Europe, and the White House, Pentagon and other centers of American/western power, how much better off the entire world would be.

    And so it is sir, with great sadness, that I, my family, and millions (billions?) of persons the world over mourn the fact that your presidency has come to an end. In this–the era where evil seems to be devouring everything in its path–to have one man stand with your unyielding conviction as you have these last 8 years and with all the forces arrayed against you by the evil doers was something that has been a source of great emotional and spiritual nourishment for persons of good will the world over and has given hope to an otherwise hopeless situation.

    Indeed, as Jesus promised, He did send prophets and sages and teachers, and although all who have come to know you over the years can see you shaking your head in disagreement over such accolades, nevertheless that is how we–all people of good will the world over–see you.

    Indeed, as Jesus predicted, these evil days will be ‘shortened for the sake of the elect’ and that ‘every tear will be wiped dry,’ and those of us blessed to have lived in these days and to have followed your work these last 8 years know that the triumph of good over evil has been brought exponentially closer as a result of your sacrifices and it is a debt we can never repay.

    And so, Mr. President, for us, your brothers and sisters in this great family of mankind who have been the beneficiaries of your courage and your strength these last 8 years, we say to you with with one voice, full of gratitude and affection–


    Mark Glenn


  119. Amir says:

    What pragmatic said is true to some extents; I take subway [almost] everyday, to and from work, and see adults and children selling things or begging, some are Kurdish young men (I had assumed they have come to Tehran for better opportunities). It’s a free country and Tehran isn’t my home, so they are welcome; some kids are dressed like baluchis (I assumed they are pilgrims from neighboring countries, who every year come to Iran and eventually leave).

    A couple of those kids stopped me near Park-e-Laleh a couple of weeks ago and forced me to but sandis for them! And after they got their Sandis they wanted cake!

    Sad? Sure! But new? Certainly not. I first came to Tehran in probably summer 2003. There were beggars, the air was kind of oily and sticky (particles stuck to my skin), the culture was obviously not to my taste, people seemed to have a total disregard for order, some people cheated and stole from fellow countrymen.

    I agree that things have become harder; but one thing that pragmatic can’t bring himself to accept is that during Doctor’s term the lower percentiles of income were able to afford “stuff” they couldn’t buy before, be that fruit, home or cars. Some people on this site think that’s the wrong way to govern a country, but I personally believe every government should empower the “have-not”; there’s debate about the method, but it’s a necessity.

    If higher education wasn’t free, my parents couldn’t afford sending three children to university. That’s a sort of “free-riding” I suppose (I didn’t pay for anything, it was financed by the nation, by beytolmal). Free higher education with meritocratic entrance exams is a “free” stuff people have come to consider their right, but it’s not “free”! They have undergone hardships to gain it, and free-market economists want to gradually erode this and there going to be some problems.

    Anyway, Mr pragmatic! Sensing others’ suffering is the beginning. I assume you are a sensible and caring individual. I’m not going to discuss the security dimensions of your call for peace. As a simpleton I can tell there is plenty to go around; where 40-50% of adult Tehranis are over-weight or obese, we could say there is enough food, but the “haves” should help out the “have-not”.

    I know hemmat110.com is a charity that could be used if you have money (I know owning a computer doesn’t mean you’re super-rich), you could put some of your money aside for enfagh every month (if you have any), if your work schedule permits you could sign up for ordu-ye-jahadi of Basij (dispersed throughout the year). If you don’t like any of this, I highly recommend you search and read papers and interviews by Dr Yousef Abazari on economics (at least a new perspective, even if you totally disagree with him).

    And about the part you mentioned our women and girls (I don’t shy away from calling them our namoos; every Iranian girl is our namoos. If economic hardship is driving anyone into indecency, I’m to be blamed for being bigheyrat), I can’t “judge” them; I mean, I can’t say there are those receiving salaries from komite-ye-emdad, so the ones you mentioned (and we now they exist, even though you probably have heard about them, and don’t know one) should follow suit. Some people won’t accept that (for whatever reason).
    But on my part, I am ready to put aside something for this problem, as well. If 8 years of war with Iraq brought people closer, I see no reason why economic war with the West can’t do the same today.

    دقت داشته باشین که نگفتم اغراض سیاسی دارین چون نفس خودتون از جای گرم بلند میشه و میخواین استقلال کشورو بدین بره برای همین دارین اشک تمساح میریزین. میخوام بگم فرض رو گذاشتم بر صداقت شما

    ordinary says:
    June 2, 2015 at 5:18 pm

    ببخشید فارسی مینویسم، اصلاً نمیدونم کجایی هستین ولی الآن حس کردم چرا حضرت آقا به آینده خوشبین هستند. میگن هر ظرفی که داخلش چیزی بریزن گنجایش کم میشه الّا دل که هر قدر داخلش بریزی بزرگتر میشه. این دلهای مالامال از ایمان هم به بقیه احساس آرامش میده، هم خستگی رو برطرف میکنه هم احساسات انسان رو رشد و تعالی میده. کلام از بیان فکر و احساس عاجز میشه حقیقتاً

  120. BiBiJon says:

    Husein’s uncompromising stance vs Hasan’s heroic flexibility

    I think it is a testament to Iran’s and a majority of Iranian’s sociopolitical sophistication that they find validity in, and support an Ahmadinejad’s term in office, as well as a Rouhani’s. The reason for that support is simply acceptance, and respect for the majority vote, while at the same time holding in high esteem the opposition. This switch of governance between different political outlooks have happened often enough and peacefully enough in Iran that I don’t think it is a huge revelation that I’m making.

    On the nuclear negotiations, if one side proves itself incapable of negotiating, that does not absolve the other party from her own principles and objectives. If Iran chooses to continue to take steps that assure onlookers of Iran’s peaceful intent, then signing onto the AP despite continuance of illegal sanctions does not require any cheesy Republican nominees’ acknowledgement. Cementing one’s higher position is important, as is the recognition that there’s more to this blessed world world than just the US domestic politics.

    To folks who consider themselves arbiters of good manners and in control of their tongues, but are too stupid to see how ill-mannered it is to wag their filthy tongue and say “Like very many other Iranians and Muslims who comment here, you are impolite and cannot control your tongue” I have only one word to say: moron!

  121. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says:

    June 3, 2015 at 11:16 am

    The fact remains that only Iranians have assaulted me verbally and physically for expressing my opinions.

    Not North Americans or Europeans.

    The fact is that only Muslims have called me a non-Muslim; I suppose if I were in a Muslim country they would try to get me killed – over differences of opinion.

    You and others like yourself are best advised to model yourself after Mr. James Canning or Mr. Evans and stop acting like uncouth barbarians.

    As for the current government; may be it should have invited the officials of the previous administration to the opening ceremonies of various projects that began under the previous government.

  122. Rehmat says:

    fyi says – it’s only the organized Jewry has called me ‘self-hating Jew’ and ‘lunatic’ for defending Muslims against Jewish Islamophobia.


  123. James Canning says:


    I take it you withdraw your assertion that I visit “white supremacist” websites.

  124. Karl.. says:

    Why are SCO against Iran? Or is it just because of the sanctions?

  125. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    June 3, 2015 at 12:31 pm

    O.K maybe I was too harsh. How is about instead I tell you my opinion of you is that you are an uncouth barbarian. Now, what are you going to call me, my ethnicity, and religiously derived characteristics just for my opinion?

  126. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says:

    June 3, 2015 at 2:05 pm

    I will no longer address you either until you apologize to me.

    You will join the list of other glorious individuals on my list – all of them Muslims.

  127. fyi says:

    James Canning says:

    June 3, 2015 at 1:09 pm

    Admitting a mistake is not his strong forte; nor is apologizing for being rude.

  128. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    June 3, 2015 at 2:15 pm

    Strong = forte. Will you admit to making a mistake and correct your gibberish to the standard phrase: ‘his forte’, or ‘his strong suit’?

  129. fyi says:

    Karl.. says:

    June 3, 2015 at 2:03 pm

    During Iran’s hour of need, SCO could have offered some political support to Iran.

    China and Russia denied Iran that political succor.

    NAM was the only international organization that stood with Iran; Syria the only Muslim country.

  130. Nasser says:

    fyi says: June 3, 2015 at 4:24 pm

    Would Iran be harmed in any way if chose to withdraw from SCO and OPEC? Hypothetically speaking of course..

    Imo what is important is that Iran should be prepared to come to an understanding with Pakistan and the so called good Taliban regarding Afghanistan. Damn the Indians, Russians or anyone else.

  131. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 3, 2015 at 4:36 pm

    I think Iran should review all international agreements and organizations that she has joined since 1850 and decide which ones to discard.

    Including UN.

    Likewise, she should decide where not to have any embassies – does Iran really need an ambassador in Eastern Europe – say in Poland? Or Serbia, or Romania?

    I do not see Iran needing to stay in OPEC, specially should she decide her oil on the spot market.

  132. Nasser says:

    fyi says: June 3, 2015 at 4:58 pm

    Perhaps you are being too emotional on UN. I don’t think that is politically possible. Iran can’t even leave NPT. But yes Iran should stop inviting all those UN agencies and NGOs in her country.

    You have commented on all these expensive embassies abroad before; and I agree of course.

    The Saudis have pretty much destroyed OPEC. Iran and Iraq needs to get out.

    Even if in a hypothetical scenario Iran was accepted into SCO, I can’t see what possible benefits it would bring her. It is but a mechanism for Russia and China to extract cooperation out of Iran for nothing in return. Not to mention, self respect requires one to stop begging endlessly.

  133. Kooshy says:

    Yea, Iran should close it’s embassies in Poland, Serbia and open new ones in Moon, Mars, or would you be more happy if she opens a new one in Tel Aviv, and a consulate in Haifa, this to make pilgrimage to the temple easier, I am sure Brits will be happy to see their faith may get some traction with the shieh country, yeah, at least in one delusional dreaming mind, Yours.

    On second note, using words Degenerate which you have used, Mofos, Sisfos, Cargo cults that has consistently been written by your approved praised asshole warm up act whom you politely and praisingly call Mr. Smith, who to me is a shity existentially scared Zionist is not insults on Iranians?, on top of that you shity Zionist think you are polite, and you deserve apology. GFYS

    I warned you three zio, moderate yourselves to not insult our Iranian, culture, way of life and religions or be ready for a new round of whack-a-mole, you will end exposing your filthy racist innersole more than what you already have.

    If you were a Muslim, like you intend to make a doubt on this blogs’ readers, at minimum you could have condemn killing of Muslim children and women in occupied Palestine by racist, apartheid Israeli Jews and Zionist like yourself. You don’t deserve to be apologized since you are silent on killing the innocent children by whom you approve, since if you don’t you replied and said it will bring a financial burden on you. You should be ashamed of yourself.

  134. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 3, 2015 at 5:41 pm

    I think Norway, several decades ago, went through that exercise and closed very many of her embassies.

    I should think embassies should be in those countries that Iran either has substantial commercial & business interaction with it or are politically important in terms of power to harm Iranian interests.

    I agree with you also about SCO; but when it came to Iran no “Cooperation” took place.

    Iran has been shabbily treated for decades – even by lesser countries.

  135. Nasser says:

    “Just as it is impossible to have an ISIL strategy without an Iraq strategy — or an Iraq strategy without a Syria strategy- it is impossible to have strategy for ISIL, Iraq, or Syria without an Iran strategy.”


    – Fight ISIS, but there must be no Sunni collateral damage; fight Shias, but protect minorities; fight Iran, but get help from Iran in fighting ISIS. Whew, quite a tall order isn’t it? One is compelled to feel at least some sympathy for US strategists like Dr. Cordesman; so many competing and contradictory interests they must balance, so many mental gymnastics they must do. Then the sympathy withers away once one realizes that it is the locals that are doing the dying while they go on playing their silly games.

  136. kooshy says:

    A very good article on geopolitics of Iran and her neighbors, a rather good analysis on balance of power in ME, on some points very close to opinion of our hosts, and a surprise how this got published on WP, perhaps on many points some of us will agree with the author.

    “Why isn’t there an anti-Iran alliance?”

    By F. Gregory Gause III June 3 at 5:30 PM


  137. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 3, 2015 at 9:55 pm

    Afghanis fought the superpowers’ war for them in Afghanistan; in the process they destroyed everything that had been built there painfully over 3 generations.

    Pakistan curried favor for US for 30 years – it became the ass-hole of the world.

  138. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 3, 2015 at 9:55 pm

    I finished reading the document that you had linked.

    It was striking that Dr. Cordesman says nothing – absolutely nothing – about destroying the logistical and financial support of ISIS, Al Nusra and others.

    That is, he does not state the need to stop the activities of Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Qatar, UAE in the financing and the material support for ISIS, Al Nusra and others.

    The Axis Powers are not serious in fighting ISIS or Al Nusra in my view.

  139. Nasser says:

    “It was striking that Dr. Cordesman says nothing – absolutely nothing – about destroying the logistical and financial support of ISIS, Al Nusra and others.”

    – Like I said so many contradictory interests they must balance. But one thing appears clear however; hurting Iran tops their agenda, their other priorities can wait.

    “The Axis Powers are not serious in fighting ISIS or Al Nusra in my view.”

    – As you have suggested I do hope the governments of Iran, Iraq and Syria has the good sense to come to an understanding with ISIS and turn their enemies’ tricks against them.

  140. James Canning says:


    I wholly agree that Rehmat is not keen to concede he has made a claim he cannot back up.

  141. Ataune says:


    It is certainly clear and interesting and somehow acknowledging the “legitimacy” of Iran’s goals as a regional power is surely a novelty but overall I think the article is faulty in several aspects.

    First, putting the ISIS at the same strategic level as the powers in the region show the ideological inclination from author rather than the reality on the ground. For me, these guys are mercenary style tools mainly driven by money and logistic from the Western proxies in the region. Until, and if, they qualitatively morph into an ideologically backed groups with a morally justified cause they can not be treated as a genuine movement with their own independent capabilities. They are at the maximum what the “freedom fighters” were in Afghanistan during the Soviet invasion.

    Second, putting Israel, SA and Turkey, formally bound by the will of stronger sovereign (although the latter with Egypt definitively having the potential), at the same level as a regional power like Iran with independent and legitimate regional goals, aspirations and force projection is truly misleading. The real battle of will in the region right now is between Iran and the US, although through her proxies.

    Third, the main logic of the article, which compare the “under-balance” between Turkey, Israel and SA on one side and Iran on the other to the situation in Europe in the 30’s and the still non-existent alliance between UK/US and USSR against the third Reich is completely biased and even non-sense.

    Before the pact between the Allied, Germany had already aggressively taken possession of almost the whole continent and was preparing to launch against Russia the ultimate fight. All the eyes were on Eastern Europe as the main battlefield for the future control of the world and the maritime powers knew that Russia and Germany together would be an insurmountable obstacle for them. Therefore UK/US felt obliged to give Russia, as a prize for her participation, part of Europe. USSR calculated that this was more than beneficial to her. This is roughly the picture at the time when the alliance formed between UK/US and USSR.

    Today, in the middle-east, the reason you cannot fathom the “victory” for the sides favored by the author is clearly not the “under-balance” resulting from a non alliance between Turkey, Israel and SA against an implied aggressive Iran. Even if some appearances may induce you to think that different ideologies, or sectarian forces, are at fight here.

    The reasons you wont have a big meaningful “alliance” in the region against Iran and therefore not a “victory”, like it happened during WWII are simple:

    1- Iran is not projecting herself as a militaristic and aggressive power;

    2- The main battle is not between regional powers looking for absolute hegemony but between outsiders looking to dominate a regional power;

    3- Turkey existence is defined from a Western looking perspective. Her battles in the region is definitely, and will furthermore, undermine her legitimacy as a state;

    4- Israel, the way she is constituted, is an alien entity in the region which will not be able to assert herself as a regional power, with or against Iran or any other potential regional power;

    5- SA legitimacy is defined as the guardian of the Islam sacred places. The house of Saoud cannot base her legitimacy on anything other and more than that;

    6- US doesn’t look anymore to the middle-east as the only valid key for the control of the world while for Iran the region is the place where she lives in. She will be ready to fight to death for her home.


  142. fyi says:

    Ataune says:

    June 4, 2015 at 2:04 pm

    On your number 5; if ISIS captures Mecca and Medina it will no longer be possible to destroy it.

  143. Ataune says:


    Interesting that you point toward this, since from my perspective they wont need to “capture” those places, they “are” already there. The house of Saoud has been in place after the British resolved their “conflicting” promises (about something that they didn’t and shouldn’t have owned) in favor of Ibn Saoud. Fahad, later defined the legitimacy of his family’s rule as the custodian of two of the three Islam sacred places. By doing so, he didn’t intend to break the Wahabi “ideology” that was always behind the Saudi existence as a state, but to give it a more nationally and geographically coherent bound and outlook. Today by reviving the Salafism and promoting the ISIS as a tool of aggression, the Saudi state is running the great risk of being hit by its own sword. This strike is surely not in the form of a physical one, as you imagine it, but an ideological one that will radicalize and ultimately ring havoc and undermine the existence of the Saoudi state.

  144. Karl.. says:

    For cying out loud
    Tony Blair to lead organization against antisemitism.

    Why isnt this man in jail?

  145. Rehmat says:

    fyi – Pakistan became “asshole” by currying favor with the US for 30 years. What would you call Israel for currying favor with the US for 67 years??

  146. Rehmat says:

    On June 1, 2015, the Jewish Week Media Group (JWMG) gave Jordan Chandler Hirsch, its Fearless Israel Supporter Award for firing the ‘Holocaust loaded gun’ at Iran’s foreign minister professor Muhammad Javad Zarif (then Iran’s envoy at United Nations) during latter’s visit to Columbia University.

    Hirsch asked the stupid question: Do you believe six million Jews died in Holocaust?

    Hirsch, as typical lying Zionist Jew, claims that Zarif dodged the question. According to Columbia University (New York) records, Zarif did answer the question.

    “I believe that numerous crimes and violence had occurred during WW II. This question must be proposed in this manner; that what was the crime of Palestinians in the violence of WW II? ,” said Zarif. What Zarif meant was that in addition to Jews many other ethnic and religious groups (Gypsies, Christians, etc.) also died during WW II. Zarif was more diplomatic than fearless Ahmadinejad.


  147. Rehmat says:

    fyi – if ISIS capture East Jerusalem – there is much greater chance that Temple Mount would rise out of the old Roman castle.


  148. Kooshy says:

    Ataune says:
    June 4, 2015 at 2:04 pm


    Thanks- and yes on your first point I agree, couple days back, responding to stupid suggestion of FYI I wrote here, that ISIL/Daeash is not an state and is not Islamic, and cannot govern since they are financially, logistically, and even militarily are supported by outside powers, never less they are there and they are acting as US’ proxies and need to be confronted.
    My real focus on the this article was to point that a major CIA propaganda outlet
    was acknowledging Iran’s rising power and her inability to control or balance the her rising power even by using her various regional client assets combined with ISIL. I think that’s also the focus of authors of this web site, and the reason why they think US needs to come to term with Iran.

    On your second point everybody knows that Israel-KSA, and Turkey are not independent states and just clients states or tools for US’ hegemony, they can be used in any format or combination as It may become necessary to US policy interests.
    So again, I think the author meant and wanted to say the same as me and you believe, but understandably he can’t be and say as overtly as we do. Yes the US proxies in the region are Daesh, Turkey, Israel, KSA, and others, and is also correct to agree that yes, Iran also has and should have regional proxies which for obvious reasons are working with Iran to resist US hegemony.
    What I believe is correct which I think the article tried to explain is US using various clients, allies and terror proxies has tried but can not contain the rising power of Iran.

  149. pragmatic says:

    To FYI,

    You are in another world! Just go back read your comments!


  150. pragmatic says:

    To: Bussed-in Basiji & Koosy

    Bussed joon your first comment explains why you are Ahmadinejad’s follower!ROFLMAO
    Why an Iranian who lives in Iran shouldn’t write or speak good English? Lets not get into this!

    AHMADINEJAD! The worst populist of century!

    During his presidency by having the biggest and largest embezzlement in history of Iran. I am sure you two won’t agree, but I don’t care because the future will show it to you. By the way, AN doesn’t have over 500K supporters in Iran. BTW, where is Rahimi.

    In regards to question who I follow, I do not follow any of them including Hassan Kleed! But I listen to those that when they talk in public what they say is the route to success. Now go figure. It could be an Osoolgara or Eslahtalab or a regular person.

    Last but not least, whoever after 8 years of Ahmadinejad thinks that he did good for Iran is insane! Today, if they take a poll that is not interfered with you will see that 95%+ of Iranian they do not approve him.

    Koosy: Can you tell us the good things as you say Ahmadinejad had done for Iran? Then, if you have the courage tell us the bad things he had done! Inane people like you should not ever come back to Iran, because we don’t like people that live overseas and talk so assertively about Iran and at the same time giving us solutions! You don’t know nothing! You live in a delusional life! May I ask what was your education, if any?!

  151. Yk says:

    For the love of God this is clearly not a good way to express your view. I am not trying to educate you but am just attempting to calm things down so that we can continue to enjoy the good geopolitical analysis that well meaning people has always provided on this site. You are free to have your opinion but please respect the feelings of those of us who have always visit this site in order to educate ourselves.

    As for the zionist trolls on this site, I recognize the right to always hit them as much as possible because spreading misinformation is as dangerous as it can get, a obvious example is the Iraq war we are all living witness to that catastrophe which those still with iota of humanity in them fervently wish will never occur again.

  152. pragmatic says:



    But I am not impolite, look at koosy in every other sentence he uses slurs! Telling us Ahmadinejad did alot for Iran is not a profanity?! I just used Inane, which is not a slur.

  153. pragmatic says:

    @koosy et al!

    Please do not distort the history, like your idol Mr. Haleh Noor. Please note the following:

    Iran’s current nuclear posture was developed to achieve a number of immediate goals and
    many long-term objectives. These goals and objectives were formulated by the Center for
    Strategic Research of the Expediency Council, before Ahmadinejad had been the president, and
    were used as a guideline to steer Iran’s negotiations with the so-called EU-3 during 2003-2005. Although the Iran-EU-3 negotiations collapsed in 2005, most of the country’s nuclear objectives have remained generally unchanged over the past few years.

    Ahmadinejad’s manipulation of the presidential election was designed partly to boost Iran’s
    leverage in its future negotiations with the United States. In other words, the “intent of the manipulation was to show that hardliners have a popular mandate.” The post-election violence and the fracturing of the Iranian elite and society had the opposite effect on Ahmadinejad’s government’s negotiating strategy.

  154. nico says:

    It seams things are heating up.
    See the last few articles in debka and veteran today websites.
    Though that surely demands confirmation as information in such time is a weapon or as some would say truth is the first victime of war.


  155. nico says:

    Karl.. says:
    June 5, 2015 at 8:24 am

    Well Afp and other media like news week reported direct involvement in Syria.
    But not sure that their sources are reliable.
    Seems to come from intelligence agencies related sources.
    Maybe that is information war.
    Who knows ?

  156. fyi says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 5, 2015 at 3:24 am

    There are things that are stupid and things that require work to get to a good place.

    There are problems that are caused by the government – such as Nekbat Islami – and things like drug addiction which is an individual choice.

  157. fyi says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 5, 2015 at 4:03 am

    One thing that Ahmadinejad did was to try his best to follow the Law and the Constitution; a first in Iran.

  158. Karl.. says:


    Personally I dont believe Iran just sent 15000 soldiers, but as you said “who knows” these days.

  159. BiBiJon says:

    What did he know, and when did he know it?

    Some of the (powerful) arguments that pro-deal camp in the US are making is a direct result of Obama’s skulduggery these past 6 years.

    Couple of examples:

    Had it not been for the extensive economic war that Obama waged against Iran, and Iran’s response of massively expanding her nuclear fuel cycle program during and as response to that economic war, today you could not cogently argue that further sanctions will not produce but the opposite of the objective.

    Had it not been for Iran’s (forced) expansion of the enrichment program to put her within 2 to 3 months of acquiring one nuke’s worth of HEU, today you could not argue that a one-year breakout is so wonderful, nor could you argue Iran does not harbor any intentions of cheating; why would one who intends to cheat, not cheat when they are withing 3 months of break out, and wait until they’re circumscribed by a one year breakout, and enhanced monitoring?

    Without seriously considering a military attack, today you could not suggest “demonstrably” that a negotiated deal is the best course, indeed, the only course left.

    Just wondering how much of the current state of affairs were preplanned, and how Hillary Clinton and Dennis Ross unwittingly helped make a deal all but inevitable in the next few weeks?

    One wonders how

  160. ordinary says:

    Chapter Twenty-Six
    Simon Bromley

    [Page 514] [British World War 1]…that while Germany was the adversary in Europe, Russia was a potential challenger in Asia. Yet Russia was for the moment an ally against Germany. How, then, could Germany be defeated without also bringing about an expansion of Russian power? It was originally in answer to this question that the importance of military operations in the Middle East was recognized.

    Britain’s aims came to include the removal of Ottoman claims to sovereignty over Cyprus and Egypt, an extension of its position in the south of Iran to include the neutral zone, and Iraq… France’s main territorial claim was for Syria and Lebanon…[Russia the rest of Persia].
    [Ordinary says: British decided the strategy, they pulled Russia into their game so that later Russia helps them, as a matter of course, in the war against Germany. British estimated that the undiscovered oil in Iraq will finance their costs].

    [much of the Islamic world] had one socio-political feature in common … in most of these ‘Islamic’ states a state
    class clearly stood in opposition to an aristocratic.. the two were socially and often ethnically distinguishable, and
    frequently antagonistic in ideology, as well as their economic base.

    [Ordinary says: This is still true. The chapter indirectly claims the fall of Ottoman empire was due to this very issue – the center did not hold].

    Iran: The central state was weak and the nobility was powerful. In1906 a constitutional revolution took place. Largely confined to Tehran, the dead-lock between the Qajar government and the Majlis was ended by the shah’s coup in1908. Acting against the liberal movement, Britain went along with Russian support for the shah….This fragmented society had been reduced to the status of a semi-colony by the incursions of Russia in the north and Britain in the south, including the flouting of its wartime neutrality. An arrangement had been formalized by the Anglo-Russian convention of 1907 ‘which divided Iran into three respective spheres of influence.

    By 1914 Ottoman influence in Arabia had ended. Ibn Saud increased his power aided by British subsidy and weapons. However, the role of Hussain as ruler of the Hejaz and thus controller of the pilgrimage, and as head of the Hashemites, constituted a threat to the authority of the Saudis.

    [Ordinary summarizes: British used Hussain army to defeat Ottoman Empire (Hussain the holder of the holy land fighting against Ottoman!) in return for a unified Arab land ruled by Hussain, they did not want to deliver that, Hussain was disgruntled, then British used Saud to discard Hussain].

    Disappointing though the economic development of the region has been, it is arguably politics rather than economics that explains this state of affairs, for it can be argued that the single biggest problem for the states of the Middle East remains the difficulty of establishing durable and effective forms of political authority that are capable of commanding the mass loyalties of their populations and pursuing encompassing strategies of social and economic transformation. At the time of writing, there is not a single state in the region that can be said to enjoy a settled legitimacy among its population, let alone secure guarantees of individual civil and political rights and democratic means of effecting a change in government.

    Three separate [issues]:
    The states of the region have struggled not only to impose domestic authority but also to manage peaceful and cooperative relations with one another.

    Secondly, …political regimes in the Middle East have displayed strong elements of sultanism [(i.e.:] private and public are fused, there is a strong tendency toward familial power and dynastic succession, there is no distinction between a state career and personal service to the ruler, and, most of all, the ruler acts only according to his own unchecked discretion, with no larger, impersonal goals.

    Thirdly, … the region [that is, the Arab Middle East] is hampered by three key deficits that can be considered defining features:
    .the freedom deficit;
    .the women’s empowerment deficit;
    .the human capabilities/knowledge deficit relative to income. (UNDP, 2002, p. 27)


    Bernard Lewis concludes his discussion of What Went Wrong? , by saying:
    It is precisely the lack of freedom – freedom of the mind from constraint and indoctrination, to question and inquire and speak; freedom of the economy from corrupt and pervasive mismanagement; freedom of women from male oppression; freedom of citizens from tyranny – that underlies so many of the troubles of the Muslim world. (2002, p.159).
    …Thus, Bernard Lewis argues that Islam has failed to follow the path of secularization pioneered in the west.

    If one asks why Islam has presented such an obstacle to the construction of secular, popular forms of national loyalty and identity, the answer, according to Lewis, is that, unlike Christianity, Islam represents a fusion of religious and political authority; it provides the basis for an extensive politico-legal order as well as a moral code (see also Lewis, 2003). Lewis illustrates this as follows: Christianity teaches its followers what is right and wrong, good and evil, but the Qur’an enjoins believers to ‘command good and forbid evil’… That is to say, there is no equivalent in Islam to Christ’s teaching to ‘render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s’. Moreover: Islam is not so much a matter of orthodoxy as of orthopraxy … What Islam has generally asked of its believers is not textual accuracy in belief, but loyalty to the community and its constituted leader … [Islam establishes a] boundary – not between orthodoxy and heterodoxy, which is relatively unimportant, but between Islam and apostasy … And apostasy, according to all schools of Muslim jurisprudence, is a capital offense. (1998, p. 126).


    Lessons to keep in mind.

  161. Karl.. says:

    Same Harper/moron that kicked Iran out of Canada now whine about Russia

  162. fyi says:

    ordinary says:

    June 5, 2015 at 12:12 pm

    The late Professor Lewis was wrong; he did not understand the roots of the Western European exceptionalism.

    For if Christianity’s teachings of Freedom had that level of importance to supposed development of empirical sciences in any society; then Ethiopia should have been just like France; and likewise for Russia or Romania.

    He is not completely wrong about the necessity of “Freedom” but Christianity is not its source in Western Europe.

  163. James Canning says:


    France refused to allow Faisal to rule an Arab kingdom based in Damascus. France blocked the creation of a “unified” Arab state, after the defeat of the Ottoman Empire.

    Britain was not in a position to prevent Ibn Saud from conquering the Hejaz.

  164. James Canning says:


    Hitler’s surprise attack on the Soviet Union left the USSR with little option but to fight.

    Churchill wanted to keep the Red Army out of as many central European countries as possible.

  165. Nasser says:

    fyi says: June 5, 2015 at 12:43 pm

    I suppose one could also ask why is Argentina not as rich as US or Canada? Being just as well endowed geographically and being (mostly) white and Christian.

    That aside, I was reading some of your previous comments and you partially attributed Iran’s lack of success to it not being an inheritor of Greek rationality.

    But then what explains in your opinion the astonishingly quick progress the East Asians and the smaller ethnic Chinese states like Taiwan and Singapore has been able to make? Was it just hard work and good leadership in your view, or something more? To my mind it seemed that there were in these states a frantic desire to catch up that I don’t see in any Muslim societies, not even in Turkey or Iran.

  166. ordinary says:

    Embezzlers exist in every country. I am glad there are investigative reporters to shed light on embezzlements to at least humiliate them, and I hope Iran goes after them using international courts, and to continuously humiliate them while they live.

    A persons instinct is to sees others in his own image until it proves otherwise. I would not blame Ahmadinejad for embezzlements, though I wish he had thought about it and had prevented it.

  167. Yk says:

    Well said, it is wrong to apply a blanket approach towards Ahmadinejad’s administration. Take it or leave it he recorded a lot of achievement but also he made some mistakes, a thing which applied to all human. Whether you believe his mistakes outweigh his achievement or vice versa is debatable and based on the angle from which you are looking at it. For some he will always be a hero and to some a villain, but love him or hate him you can never ignore him.

  168. fyi says:

    ordinary says:

    June 5, 2015 at 1:33 pm

    Yes, he embezzled money, that is why he and his wife are living in that house in Narmak – instead of living in Niyavaran.

  169. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 5, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    I think it was a combination of factors.

    In Japan, for example, in 1860, their illiteracy rate was similar to Iran’s in 1960.

    And in 1860, the ruling clans in Japan shared a consensus on what needs to be done.

    Furthermore, Japan was and is a much more coherent and homogeneous country than Iran; in 1860 Iranian polity was fractured among tribes, clans, urbanites as well as among linguistically variegated people; with no counter part in Japan.

    Lastly, Japanese people, to foreigners, seem extremely conformist – probably because through years of intermittent civil wars they learnt that they need to be less individualistic than even the Chinese and Koreans.

    For all 3, hard work is certainly the foundation of their success – in Japan they work until late at night.

  170. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    June 5, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    There is a book that tries to answer your specific question on North American vs. South American economic prosperity: http://www.amazon.ca/Why-Nations-Fail-Origins-Prosperity/dp/0307719227

    Obviously it is not the whole story, but should be taken along with other scholarly views.

    But overall, there are two types of development. One is inherent, self-sustaining and ground-breaking progress that is authentic to nation in question. This nation would be the alpha in development eg. France, UK, Germany etc etc. The hallmark of these nations is their cultural acceptance of rational thought and welcoming the new questions and innovations.

    The other kind of development is a second hand, orbital and circling the alpha developmental model which a nation incapable of generating its own authentic progress may implement. Such a nation accepting its inability to integrate rational thinking into its society, makes do with trusting the alphas on matters of thinking. The hallmark of such nations is their strive for being accepted as an honorary member of West.

    Countries like Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore etc etc are good followers of alphas. Therefore you see Intel inventing and designing the chips, and Taiwan manufacturing them on large scale. Naturally such a nation has to be a hard worker. Alpha style leisure and indulgence can not be tolerated.

    Japan is a special case and falls somewhere in between these two.

    Then there are nations in which still the magic rules. The magic which our present/past elders said about, that all which could ever be said has already been said, that the wisdom is a closed system which was imparted to elders by God and the humanity should follow the elders ideas, that innovation and questioning is against the holy magic and deserving of punishment, that the PROMISE will be fulfilled and someday the planes will land on your zigzagging runway alongside the bamboo control tower and then you will be rich and happy, all by the grace of magic.

    These are the cargo cult nations who love to have the latest Intel chip but have no contribution in its invention, innovation, designing and manufacturing. Naturally and until the fulfillment of the PROMISE, they make do by trading whatever they have for what they desire, eg trading oil, gas, minerals, geopolitical rent, their women and even children for gizmos, medicines, plane loads of planes and what you call “opium” etc etc.

    The hallmark of such nations is their pride in their unquestioning but diverse beliefs which can be quite ridiculous for example desiring to have personal transportation machines of Germany and living like Swiss and relaxing like Danes but without an iota of scientific belief systems, rational thought capacity or the hard work. The only solution to reconcile their desires with reality is fictionally possible through magic.

    Mr Fyi, you and me are arguing for Iran to be the alpha.

    The rest here are arguing for Iran to be the other cases or the variations of.

    All the talk about geopolitical mumbo jumbo, will end in this since national power is not magical. It follows the national capacity and abilities.

  171. M.Ali says:

    I guess they don’t hide it anymore…

    Israelis and Saudis Reveal Secret Talks to Thwart Iran
    Eli Lake
    149 JUN 4, 2015 4:42 PM EDT
    By Eli Lake
    a A
    Since the beginning of 2014, representatives from Israel and Saudi Arabia have had five secret meetings to discuss a common foe, Iran. On Thursday, the two countries came out of the closet by revealing this covert diplomacy at the Council on Foreign Relations in Washington.

    Among those who follow the Middle East closely, it’s been an open secret that Israel and Saudi Arabia have a common interest in thwarting Iran. But until Thursday, actual diplomacy between the two was never officially acknowledged. Saudi Arabia still doesn’t recognize Israel’s right to exist. Israel has yet to accept a Saudi-initiated peace offer to create a Palestinian state.

    It was not a typical Washington think-tank event. No questions were taken from the audience. After an introduction, there was a speech in Arabic from Anwar Majed Eshki, a retired Saudi general and ex-adviser to Prince Bandar bin Sultan, the former Saudi ambassador to the U.S. Then Dore Gold, a former Israeli ambassador to the United Nations who is slotted to be the next director general of Israel’s foreign ministry, gave a speech in English.

    While these men represent countries that have been historic enemies, their message was identical: Iran is trying to take over the Middle East and it must be stopped.


  172. M.Ali says:

    Also, pragmatist, it is always nice to have different views but you can’t come in with all guns blazing. You can claim you don’t like Ahmadenijad (that’s why we vote) but it would be a much more fruitful for everyone if you didn’t dismiss and insult other people’s views.

    Its such a norm for our societies to make up percentages of the full society based on unsupported ideas. In another forum, an Egypt was saying that not even 5% of Egyptians support Morsi. So, I guess its not unique to our Iranian culture.

    Saying stuff like this doesn’t help anyone understand anything,
    ” Today, if they take a poll that is not interfered with you will see that 95%+ of Iranian they do not approve him.” Where did you get 95% from? Your circle of friends, your own feeling, the environment? All of these are faulty.

    On the other hand, look at this current poll,

    “A recent iPOS poll found that former Iranian president Mahmood Ahmadinejad would perform better than expected in the next presidential election thanks in large part to his high favorability rating among Iranians without university degree and those who are living in rural areas.

    The survey, conducted on February 14 to 15 2015, shows that in a head-to-head matchup President Rohani has a modest edge over former President Ahmadinejad, 28% to 24%.

    Mr. Rohani’s margin is 10% better among respondents in urban areas. Mr. Ahmadinejad, however, has a 9% advantage among ”

    Not even two years, and already we are seeing people remembering him fondly. I told all my friends that I will bet that in a few years, people will start to again talk positively about the doctor. This is also a very Iranian thing. We love the thing that was gone.

  173. ordinary says:

    For a Moslims prosperity is defined as proximity to God (on this, I did not see a contradiction in other regions, confirming God’s words: “there is no difference in the words of God”). To a human, material wealth gains value as he gets further away from God. Maximum possible closeness to God is “true reliance in God in all affairs personal and otherwise”.

    As a Moslim walks the line and gets closer, unless it is a Islamic society, his/her interest and contributions to furthering a prosperous Eastern or Western model (based on commercialism and increasingly profiting by exploiting human weaknesses) decreases and he ultimately shies away; because God has declared we are responsible for what our hands brings forth (this applies to present and future and future generations).

    Education, hard work, innovations, defense, governance, social programs of all sorts, bettering life are paramount in Islam. But while an individual can get very wealthy, there is no race to getting wealthy; wealth must be spend prudently. An individual’s responsibility increases with the size of his wealth (remembering God declared we are responsible for what our hands brings forth), hence for example: leaving the wealth unreasonably to a child that devour it fails that responsibility. Rich has his chance to spend and invest to better life “while he is alive”. For example, God also limits the amount a Moslim gives to a poor, yes, feed, but the wealth most be spent to uproot the cause.

    There are very few muslims that conduct their lives as described above, human nature works against it, and human is required to take control of his desires in the logic of God. The most successful period was under King David, as the accompanying books of Torah explains the level of prosperity then achieved, even during King David, there was a lot of resistance against the rule of God.

    The notion weakened and resurrected again as God sent more and more prophets, until prophet Mohammad delivered the last warning, the book once again, including the full model and Velayat (that there are people among us, the Imams, that there will be no time, we might claim, that we tried and found no light) for his creatures, so there be no dispute when the time comes.

    The point of is, in Iran, the aim is to approach prosperity and success in the way King David accomplished it, in the way of God. Hence the struggle of Iran and most middle eastern countries, to get to prosperity while in the straight path.

    At the end however, per my understanding, we are individually responsible for what our hands brings forth. If Iran fails at the end, the impact has been made and was a very successful one – it undid the damages of many kings of its past and was a light among nations. On the other hand, for material prosperity now, look westward or eastward, for one can get to that prosperity much faster than trying to fix Iran.

  174. Nasser says:

    fyi says: June 5, 2015 at 3:34 pm

    Thanks for your comment.

    On matters of hard work and labor productivity, this is what Sergey Karaganov had to say about those issues as it relates to Russia:
    “No one knows what impact the sanctions can have on the Russian economy in the medium and long term. The dramatic fall of the ruble in late 2014 is an alarming signal. On the positive side, it has enhanced the competitiveness of Russian enterprises for the next two to four years, but, most importantly, it has in fact slashed average incomes in dollars and euros which have been growing three or four times faster than labor productivity in the past several years.”

    If only the Iranian population could internalize this and curb their appetite for handouts and wealth redistribution.

  175. Nasser says:

    Smith says: June 5, 2015 at 4:25 pm

    Many thanks for the book recommendation. I am watching interviews by the authors right now.

    Of course you rightly chastise the fantasy land that most in third world countries seem to reside in but I think you are being too harsh on those East Asian countries. I am filled with immense admiration for their industriousness, discipline and organization skills. No western society can produce a politician of the caliber of Lee Kwan Yew. And let us not forget, like the Indian IT companies, they are selling brain power not oxen labor. I can’t see how they could have done any better or achieved what they did more quickly than they did. I don’t think most Americans thought they would get beyond manufacturing garments and shoes when they started this. It is quite remarkable how disorganized and unproductive Iranians are in comparison. Our only claim to pride is that we are better than Khaleejis; well even my pet labrador is better than those clowns.

  176. Rehmat says:

    UK’s former prime minister and Quartet (the US, EU and Russia) envoy for the Middle East since 2002, Tony Blair, has a new job at Europe’s major Zionist lobby group as its new policeman to shield Zionists’ and Israeli crimes.


  177. fyi says:

    ordinary says:

    June 5, 2015 at 6:32 pm

    Keep writing such rubbish and keep lulling Muslims into their sleep.

    Prosperity means this:

    At 8:00 PM you start experiencing sever chest pains and at 11:00 PM a heart surgeon is awakened that proceeds to install 2 stents in your LAD and thus saves your life – because a prosperous society had been able to develop the technology to save your life and prevent your wife to become a widow and your children orphans.

    Likewise, on a holiday afternoon you start experiencing excruciating dental pain and an emergency dentist works on your tooth; drains the puss, and saves what is left of your tooth – because the society was prosperous enough to perform research who developed new materials and techniques that could then be applied by other trained experts to save you from pain and agony and the indignity of tooth loss.

    Do not kid yourself.

  178. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 5, 2015 at 7:55 pm

    Wipro started as a cooking oil emporium by a Muslim.

    Then it went into assembling IBM PC clones.

    Then it got into Networking and light programming.

    Then it became what it is today.

    When they started, many of the employees of the Indian IT sector were inspired by Indian nationalism; they wanted to move their country forward.

  179. fyi says:

    Nasser says:

    June 5, 2015 at 7:23 pm

    From 1990 to 2008, many professional salaries in Spain quadrupled.

    Sustained by binge borrowing from Northern European banks.

    During the same time, in US, you would have been lucky to experience a doubling of your income among the professional classes.

    Now salaries in Spain are back to twice what they were 20 years ago – back to reality.

    I knew a Refusnick who had been a manager in USSR and who told me that the workers, under Communism, had no work ethic. In fact, when he confronted a staff member when she was habitually late; she said: “You expect us to work too?”.

    USSR – like Iran – also was widely subsidizing its population when labor productivity was either lagging or was going negative.

  180. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 5, 2015 at 4:25 pm

    Yes, development is the need of the hour, the day, the year, the century for Iran and Muslims.

    Yet Arabs and Turks and Pakistanis are dragging us all back; causing us to fall further and further behind.

  181. BiBiJon says:

    ordinary says:
    June 5, 2015 at 6:32 pm

    Be careful. Just for expressing your opinion, the uncouth barbarian on this forum, who clearly comes from a long uninterrupted lineage of utterly lazy, superstitious, bigoted, disreputable barbarians, will put you down, and insult you and come up with some idiotically emotional gibberish. The moron whose only “strong forte” seems to be insulting people will not relent, has no manners, and is completely shameless.

    At some point, by his design, you may respond and call fyi what he deserves to be called. And, of course, then he vexes all indignant, and hurt. Pay no attention to a goofball that imagines the descendents of ibn Sina aren’t on call in Iran’s hospitals.

    What motivates him? The unstoppable rise of Iran. What he calls the islamic nekbat, has been sitting with world powers, and is on the verge of an historic realignment of world affirs. He just cannot take it.

  182. Amir says:

    ordinary says:
    June 5, 2015 at 6:32 pm

    Just stating my opinion here:
    I believe we aren’t “destroyed” after we die, we just go from one world to another and we will be held accountable for what we did (and said, and even thought).

    On the definition of progress and prosperity and whether Islam is against it or not, there has been substantial debate before (since Napoleon set foot in Egypt, or Ottomans started tasting defeat at the hands of Europeans); I’m not of the caliber to add anything.

    One thing I could say, is that one shouldn’t lose focus; for all I know, religion isn’t cargo cult (even if the majority treats it that way). There a God, who is the God of all, of us, and those before us and those after us, and there’s an after-life; no one’s preaching asceticism and self-denial, or retiring from world, but those who dismiss the bigger picture, will see soon what they had been dismissing as اساطیر الاولین as those before them did.

  183. Amir says:

    ordinary says:
    June 5, 2015 at 6:32 pm
    I just had to write this:

    At the moment I think (which might change over time) that some people on this site understand that individualism, laissez faire economics, indulging one’s urges and moral relativism don’t work; there should be a limit to one’s heart’s desires.

    I was randomly checking some older posts on the site (http://goingtotehran.com/obama-and-the-mismanagement-of-imperial-decline#comments, Smith says: January 24, 2013 at 3:07 pm) and there Mr Smith was arguing that the whole world is in decay, and (very very surprisingly, to me) Shia Islam could be an alternative for saving humanity (wow, I know!!). Of course he then mentioned that (not in this particular wording, but the gist of it was that) he wasn’t talking about the Shia Islam in its conventional sense, but one he describes as a rationalistic one etc etc.

    I sense that 1) it’s very similar to his understanding of Emam Khomeini (that Emam was more like Reza Khan than let’s say, I don’t know, Sheykh Ansari, 2) what Bused-in-Basiji told me earlier was oddly true! I could just say wow! WOW!!

    On the bright side, existence of monafegh proves that the mainstream isn’t totally unacceptable (otherwise they didn’t have to twist the truth, and pretend to be someone who they weren’t, they could come out and outright deny everything).
    On the other hand, the field just got infinite time harder. For every ten persons
    who understand that Islam ناب محمدي صلي الله عليه و آله و سلم is the path, nine somehow
    would eventually get mislead. You might wonder by who?

    I hope this post won’t be used as a trigger to insult and assault those deemed monafeghin or kuffar; they don’t know any better, and زين لهم الشيطان اعمالهم. Even if they are scaremongers who are trying to get our country invaded and all of us killed,
    as Emam had said before
    در اين روزها ممکن است بسياري از افراد به خاطر احساسات و عواطف خود صحبت از چراها و بايدها و نبايدها کنند. هر چند اين مسئله به خودي خود يک ارزش بسيار زيباست، اما اکنون وقت پرداختن به آن نيست. چه بسا آنهايي که تا ديروز در برابر اين نظام جبهه گيري کرده بودند و فقط به خاطر سقوط نظام و حکومت جمهوري اسلامي ايران از صلح و صلحطلبي به ظاهر دم مي زدند، امروز نيز با همان هدف سخنان فريبنده ديگري را مطرح نمايند، و جيره خواران استکبار، همانها که تا ديروز در زير نقاب دروغين صلح، خنجرشان را از پشت به قلب ملت فرو کرده بودند، امروز طرفدار جنگ شوند و ملي گراهاي بي فرهنگ براي از بين بردن خون شهداي عزيز و نابودي عزت و افتخار مردم، تبليغات مسموم خويش را آغاز نمايند. که انشاءاللّه ملت عزيز ما با بصيرت و هوشياري جواب همه فتنه ها را خواهد داد.
    but he has also said that
    البته ما مطمئنيم که در همين شرايط نيز آنها که با روحانيت اصيل کينه ديرينه دارند و عقده ها و حسادتهاي خود را نمي توانند پنهان سازند آنان را به باد ناسزا گيرند. ولي در هر حال آن چيزي که در سرنوشت روحانيت واقعي نيست سازش و تسليم شدن در برابر کفر و شرک است. که اگر بندبند استخوانهايمان را جدا سازند، اگر سرمان را بالاي دار برند، اگر زنده زنده در شعله هاي آتشمان بسوزانند، اگر زن و فرزندان و هستيمان را در جلوي ديدگانمان به اسارت و غارت برند هرگز اماننامه کفر و شرک را امضا نمي کنيم.
    Even if all of us are killed and our women and children are enslaved, we have done
    what God and religion had asked.

    Also, reading what Mr Smith had said back then (I have been visiting here for maybe 10 months by now), I could tell he had hopes and his hopes were dashed , because he thought Iranians had withered and sold everything, and the whole cargo-cult stuff (although I should admit he displays high animosity towards the clergy and the mainstream interpretaion of Islam, even then). I assume he didn’t live in Iran during Iran-Iraq war (I was 2 when the war ended), he isn’t living here now, and he doesn’t have a first-hand experience of Iranians. The extent of his knowledge about Islam is limited to کاروان اسلام يا البعثة الاسلامية الي البلاد الافرنجية by Sadegh Hedayat.

    I have the good news for him that Iranians by and large are extremely resilient and in the event that negotiations break down, instead of despair they’ll double down their efforts.
    Evidence? Several days ago I was talking to one of my colleagues with a shaved face and necktie (who Mr FYI considered a good Muslim, but was an agnostic, and just wants to leave Iran because he can’t take it anymore) and he admitted that recent restrictions on Medicine graduates from Iran imposed by US treasury department on ECFMG are designed to make Iranian physicians restless or impatient with the negotiations and the state, but if they (the Americans) think we would rebel against our government they are mistaken; if anything this will just give us more reason to support the government, the state and the Leader.
    Iranians are very very resilient, even more so than Russians. Oriental implacability
    knows no boundary.

    Engaging in negotiations to end sanctions, or unfreeze OUR money isn’t treason, selling-out or laziness. The whole negotiations could be blamed on “cargo-cult muleteers”, Rohani, Hashemi Rafsanjani, Velayati, Mafia bitches, Dr Salehi (of atomic energy agency), but the matter of fact is that no one is interested in taking damage if one could avoid it; when it becomes apparent that there is no way but frontal confrontation, we could say that at least we exploited every other means.

    Many are frustrated, but لاتقنطوا من رحمة الله. And this is getting awfully long, but Kooshy asked he didn’t get it why some Yazdis don’t like Ahmadinejad. Emam solved
    this mystery years ago when he said:
    مبارزه با رفاه طلبي سازگار نيست، و آنها که تصور مي کنند مبارزه در راه استقلال و آزادي مستضعفين و محرومان جهان با سرمايه داري و رفاه طلبي منافات ندارد با الفباي مبارزه بيگانه اند. و آنهايي هم که تصور مي کنند سرمايه داران و مرفهان بي درد با نصيحت و پند و اندرز متنبه مي شوند و به مبارزان راه آزادي پيوسته و يا به آنان کمک مي کنند آب در هاون مي کوبند. بحث مبارزه و رفاه و سرمايه ، بحث قيام و راحتطلبي ، بحث دنياخواهي و آخرتجويي دو مقوله اي است که هرگز با هم جمع نمي شوند. و تنها آنهايي تا آخر خط با ما هستند که درد فقر و محروميت و استضعاف را چشيده باشند…

    Sorry, I had to get this off my chest.

  184. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    June 5, 2015 at 7:55 pm

    You are welcome, Mr Nasser.

    I just try my best to lay the truth forth as I see it. If it is harsh, then it is subject of the truth that has to take the blame.

    Late Mr Yew was not a Western styled politician unless if you want to include benevolent dictators as politicians. You see, West no longer even needs such benevolent leaders of dictatorial or of otherwise inclinations. They are past these stages. Let’s see if Singapore or for that matter the entire Eastern world can produce one politician such as Francis Bacon. This is a better challenge. More consequential too.

    I am not trying to belittle what Mr Yew or many like him did for their nations. Compared to Iran, they did wonders. During the 1980’s and 90’s, Iranian muleteers used to go to Singapore and buy Singapore manufactured IC’s, hide them in various orifices on and in their body and smuggle them into Iran to be used in repair of electronic consumer products. In those times, the Iranian government used to treat IC’s as a national security risk and had restricted their imports. Mr Yew on other hand had invested in IC fabrication plants. I am chronically aware of these facts.

    But compared to West, Singapore and others like it, are light years behind. Not in material dimension. And certainly not in matters of discipline or hard work. But in matters of original thought and creativity. Gone are the days when labor was required. Automated machines are taking over, and where economically not feasible there are plenty of nations begging to be invested in their cheap labor. And gone are the days, when labor used to mean physical work. Coding millions of lines for a program, is also labor which is increasingly being divested by West. In near future, even these coders might not be needed as AI, would be sufficiently sophisticated to do the job. Already efforts are underway to design evolutionary algorithms which improve on designs.

    West is moving towards a future where information-machine fusion would make such areas whether the oxen labor or contract coding obsolete. What matters in West now, is pure creativity and talent. A gigantic effort is underway in West to fuse the human knowledge, biology with mathematics and physics with philosophy. This seamless body of knowledge will be kind of a singularity which will bring immense power for those who hold it. And this is only for the knowledge which we know already exists. From standard model of particles in physics to ongoing efforts to engineer whole human organs. Other Western efforts in material sciences or in fundamental physics are also underway. Who knows what potential dark matter holds? Who knew in 19th century what potential nuclear and quantum physics held?

    I do not see Singapore, Korea, Taiwan etc etc and even honestly Japan to be breaking grounds here.

    As always the white man of West and increasingly of late, his girlfriend are at the forefront. The white man will not stop at garments or at nuclear physics or at silicone based computing or even at dark matter. Something in them that is not in others propels them to tweak the universe in geometrically increasing ways. Salavat.

  185. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    June 5, 2015 at 8:37 pm

    There is a certain category of Muslims of Indian origin who have done well, mostly because they were associated with British for a long time. People like Sir Syed Ahmad Khan were a product of an evolutionary social system in British Raj. And it is not limited to India itself, this category of Indians through their association with British, learning tricks of the trade did well in Africa, in South East Asia and even in Island nations of Pacific and Atlantic.

    For instance Mr Premji of WIPRO was an Ismaili of Gujarati ethnicity. Ismailis themselves are very modernists in the Islamic context and more often than not are not even considered Muslims by other “main stream” Muslims. Then Gujaratis are probably the most business oriented people of India. Such examples are exceptions that prove the rule. Not other way around.

  186. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    June 5, 2015 at 8:44 pm

    Consider these facts:

    This nation still believe modern medicine is based on Avicenna knowledge and the West has stolen the Islamic science.

    I would rather not deputize this on Turks or Arabs or Pakistanis or Malays. Iranians are the reason for the backwardness of Iran. The nekbat Islami of Shia Isis types who have nothing better to do or the ability to think beyond their jealousies and their hypocrisies. Their Sunni counterparts are slaughtering their way to ultimate progress and development of their “Kingdom of David”. I frankly see no difference. If it was not for Mr Khomeini leashing and muzzling these animals, today we would have seen even worse doings by the Shias.

  187. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    June 5, 2015 at 8:35 pm

    Ah, the hypocrites. When the pain sets in and confronted with the possibility of meeting their creator, they always demand the latest American invented treatments to postpone the divine call. For themselves and their families. Marg khobeh vali baraye hamsaye. This is their moral foundation.

    In Kingdom of David, there was no tenecteplase, ekg or troponin kits. People submitted to divine rule and called it quits. One wonders what stops these wannable camel and tent loving citizens of Kingdom of David to submit themselves to divine fate?

  188. Nasser says:

    fyi says: June 5, 2015 at 8:44 pm

    “Yet Arabs and Turks and Pakistanis are dragging us all back; causing us to fall further and further behind.”

    – Well yes, but Iran so far is only marginally better. It too has failed in its developmental goals.

    – I have been thinking, Japan’s experience must have had a profound psychological impact on the other countries of the region that later followed her, successfully. Later, Lee Kwan Yew made a very serious impression on Deng Xiaoping and the Chinese leadership. First watching Japan, then one by one the examples of Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan, Korea, it must have become clear that if these culturally similar people can do it, we can too. There is nothing hocus pocus magical about it; nothing uniquely western about it.

    – I get now why you have said Iran is the only chance other Muslim polities have of ever reaching anywhere near the development levels of Western societies. Iran is the only Muslim polity with the unique combination of cultural and material endowments that could have pulled it off organically. Not Indonesia, not Pakistan, not Egypt, not even Turkey.
    But Iran’s intended audience look at its supposed “achievements” and they are not too impressed and they figure, this is no way. Some of them see Dubai and they think that is a way. So we have iphone totting Muslims who think being a cargo cultist American servant is the way to go. The others believe in in their fantasies of 6th century Islamic glory and think throat slitting infidels is the way to go. Only people that cling to Iran are those out of sheer desperation for their physical survival.

  189. Karl.. says:

    I didnt forecast this forum turning into a “white mans burden” club, pushed by non-white people. Thats spectacular.

  190. Nasser says:

    Smith says: June 6, 2015 at 2:54 am

    But why can’t others copy them if they conceptualize something of such massive consequence? Why do others have to respect their IP? Did the Soviets or the Chinese say since you came up with nukes, we will respect your monopoly on such ungodly and dangerous items?

    The problem with Muslim polities is that they are not even in the game! They have not even started! How old is the internal combustion engine, how long ago did the Concorde take flight, how long ago did they start fabricating microchips, how long ago did they first explode a thermonuclear bomb, how long ago did they manage to put someone on the moon?! Can any Muslim polity replicate these decades old feats even today; even though they are struggling to barely feed their people like China or India, even though they don’t have to conceptualize new things and have so much computing power now and so much open source knowledge available? They are sleeping, totally oblivious. And as fyi points out we are falling further and further and further behind. That is because as you point out, advancement in one area impacts other areas, and then integrates together; making modern manufacturing extremely complex. And also as you point out, the West isn’t resting on their laurels. Their frantic pace continues. At this rate we will never ever catch up.

    But the commercial competitions they face from the East Asian economies are very real and have hurt their working classes tremendously. I am not some chicken little who claims some Western economies are on the verge of collapse. But I do know that their societies and American society in particular has its own social cleavages.

    A Russian view on some of the problems US policies has created for itself with their globalization policies:

  191. MassoudH says:

    Karl.. says: June 6, 2015 at 4:08 am

    “I didnt forecast this forum turning into a “white mans burden” club, pushed by non-white people. Thats spectacular.”

    Tell me about it! Seriously, this is so disconcerting…

  192. MassoudH says:

    “The American gambling magnate and major Republican party donor Sheldon Adelson is hosting a closed-door meeting of pro-Israel billionaires and activists at his Las Vegas casino this weekend, to combat the burgeoning movement on US university campuses to boycott the Jewish state…

    Resolutions in support of universities divesting from Israel have passed on seven campuses this year and been rejected on eight others. In December 2013, the American Studies Association voted to boycott Israeli academic institutions. The BDS movement is particularly strong at the University of California, which has about 240,000 students.

    Yousef Munayyer, director of the US Campaign to End the Israeli Occupation, said that the Las Vegas meeting and increased political pressure on the BDS movement is a reflection of its growing strength.

    “You see a trajectory that follows that famed Mahatma Gandhi quote. First they ignore you. Then they laugh at you. Now we’re at the third stage which is, then they fight you,” he said. “We’re seeing it in the public pronouncements of Israeli officials. In the adoption of some of those positions by American officials. We’re seeing it in legislatures both at the state and federal level in the United States where there are initiatives to pass laws that would make it more difficult to advance BDS victories.””


  193. MassoudH says:

    To all,

    I’m on an occasional visit to Iran currently, writing to you from the shores of the Caspian. There is a great deal of anticipation and nervousness here about the nuclear talks and where they may lead to. People are anxious about the economy as well as the sheer scale of corruption, and a recent 40% petrol price hike (now at about 30 US cents a litre) has raised many questions about Rohani’s economic policies. Regional turmoil also has many people concerned about the prospects for war.

    Yet, the people are noticeably calmer than before. Tehran is incredibly green compared to how it was before, and the madness on the roads (in terms of how people drive) has subsided very noticeably. Iran is clearly moving toward a more orderly and regulated system, and there is plenty of music in the air wherever you go. I have come across several people dancing on the beaches here, and there is no segregation on the beaches where I am staying, which is not far from Ramsar. The irrational obsession with women’s hijab has clearly subsided.

    An interesting contributing factor to the situation appears to be a general realisation among the Iranian public (of various religious and political persuasions) of the fact that the West, Russia, Israel and Saudi Arabia are by no means to be trusted, particularly in light of the events of the past few years. People generally agree that the only effective way to protect Iran’s interests rests with Iranians. This is not to say that they are all content with the Islamic system of governance – far from it. You should have seen the volume of traffic heading for the Caspian region from Tehran on the anniversary of Khomeini’s passing. But they are too wise to throw the baby out with the bath water, as there are far too many foreign threats against the wellbeing of the Iranian population.

  194. pragmatic says:

    To: M. ALI

    I read your comment thoroughly. I have two questions which I like to address them to you, and those who are in the same line of thoughts. I will then respond to you accordingly. Please note:

    1- Do you currently live in Iran?

    2- Why did Mr. Ahmadinejad shut down the “sazman-e-barnameh va boodjeh”, when he commenced his presidency?

    I look forward to your reply.

    To: Dear Mr. FYI,

    I am sorry but I really do not understand what you are trying to convey. I am a dummy. Henceforth, I won’t correspond to your posts. At the same time, I appreciate if you do the same about my posts.

    آنکس که بداند و بداند که بداند
    اسب شرف از گنبد گردون بجهاند
    و آنکس که نداند و نداند که نداند
    بیدارش نمائید که بس خفته نماند

  195. Amir says:

    MassoudH says:
    June 6, 2015 at 5:59 am

    The part … “You should have seen the volume of traffic heading for the Caspian region from Tehran on the anniversary of Khomeini’s passing” suggests there are two distinct “Irans”; the one living in Northern half of Tehran, waiting to go to shomal, and the part (jonub-e-Tehran, plus many small towns and villages) which traveled to commemorate passing away of Emam.

    It’s a welcome sign that the former are realizing that the West is not trustworthy. The latter were vigorously chanting “نه سازش! نه تسلیم! نبرد با آمریکا” at the top of their lungs.

    So… that’s one issue resolved. Call it siege mentality, or whatever.

  196. pragmatic says:

    In regards to former president Ahmadinejad, I won’t be surprised if he is trialed. Rafsanjani has sent a letter to Rahbari. Hashemi also wants to emerge Sepah and Artash together.

    I never was an avid fan of his, however, after reading most of his speeches since 1979, I see that he is way above the rest when it comes to politics. Also, since 2009 and the last election his popularity has tenfold! No one can deny this.

    I have realized that every time he says or writes you ought to read between the lines!

    As Imam said: Nehzat zendeh ast ta Hashemi zendeh ast”.

    I hope he’ll be in good health for many years to come.

    حرف آخر آقای هاشمی واکنش به تعبیر یکی از میهمانان است که گفته بود آقای هاشمی! نگذارید جبهه ندیده ها مدعی شوند. آقای هاشمی رو به همان رزمنده می گوید نگران اینها نباشید. اینها تریبون زیاد دارند. ولی مردم را ندارند. این را هم همه باید بدانند. “اگر با مردم نباشیم، باختیم”. مطمئن باشید خواست مردم امروز صلح و توافق عزتمندانه است. هر کسی هم که دنبال جنگ و قطع مذاکره است حرف خودش را می زند. نه حرف مردم را …

  197. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 6, 2015 at 6:35 am

    Maybe you shouldn’t tie your future to someone who has always considered people as shapeless masses, easily manipulated and peasants who obey whoever feeds them.

    But, you are entitled to your opinion, maybe I’m wrong.

  198. nahid says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 6, 2015 at 6:35 am az tajereh pesteh foroshan defa nakon

    حال چون عده‌ای یا نمی‌‌خواهند و یا نمی‌توانند این مسائل را کنار هم بچینند، فکر می‌کنند این مسئله توسط احمدی‌نژادها برای کشور ایجاد و مدیریت شده؛ اما غافلند که این نئواحمدی‌نژادیسم‌ها (مردم بیدارشده انقلابی به دست حاکمیت در زمان احمدی‌نژاد) هستند که خودجوش وارد میدان شدند و به طلب حق و حقوق خود پرداختند.



  199. Bussed-in Basiji says:


    Inshallah ba Akbar Shah mashhoor beshi, elahi ameen.

    Also what’s interesting is how boy wonder’s point about Iran’s “scientific” backwardness is not based on “scientific” facts.

    Now that’s a “scientific” riddle worth investigating…


  200. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    In the words of Freddie Mercury…”another one gone, another one bites the dust…”


    “…hey gonna get you too, another one…”

  201. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    You see the story is that all this fuss is about Iran industrializing and advancing technologically at a level that cargo-cult muleteers were not supposed to…loosening the bonds of servitude to westerners and- dare I say- becoming direct rivals…(no! don’t tell me!)

    …all of it when revolutionary Shia Islam became the basis of socio-political governance in Iran and under severe sanctions.

    These last two points have burned many, many, many asses in Iran and outside and this in turn let’s us understand why assorted douchebags (sorry to be rude) here and there are guns-a-blazin’ against Iran, Iranians, Muslims, hezbollahis and anything that might be positive news from these.

    Either we continue to industrialize and continue our stunning techno growth (contrary to douchebags claims) or we go back to western corporate/cultural dalali and mass unemployment in the Hashemi-Rafsanjani/Pahlavi school of socio-economic (under)development.

    There is no third option.

  202. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    And also I mentioned a matter a couple years ago and it’s still bugging me and that is that according to IMF, WB Iran’s GDP PPP is 1,3 trillion and interestingly there is a 300 BILLION increase in the number right when Rohani government comes in.

    It’s total bullshit that Iran’s economy is 1-1.3 trillion. Iran’s economy is at least 2-2,5 trillion making it a top ten economy globally.

    Assorted douchebag dalals and there friends in the west now this, but of course they have to play the act of “the economy sucks” and so you have to let us save you from poverty and barbarianism with western culture and technology.

    What load of bull…

    Iran is industrializing, it’s becoming a technological power and it’s economy is a top ten economy.

    Time for domestic douchbags and western friends to take profits…and sell all of this theft and fleecing to Iranians and western elites as “development”, “peace”, “welfare”, “strategic realignment”…!

  203. ordinary says:

    @fyi and Smith

    Understanding of A is A gets properly adjusted once one gets the notion of A, and you will not be an exception.

    Meanwhile, don’t let Moslim hypocrites bias you senses. At some point in life devote time to a reading of Quran. You will get to know all types of hypocrites (I’m not being facetious).

    As to lolables, they are safer in God’s side.

  204. BiBiJon says:

    Animals that need muzzling:


    Putin Interview:


    Iran’s military from DoD’s PoV


    The nuclear Negotiation, pls give us more time to sabotage:


  205. BiBiJon says:

    Mr Amano did it again:


  206. Kooshy says:

    Basiji says:
    June 6, 2015 at 10:05 am
    And another one

    BIB Jaan

    It’s not these trios zios fault, they don’t know about the scientific progress in Iran, they are not trying to ignore it, is just that these scientific magazines you linked above, they don’t get it in Haifa, besides any Internet search they do, it has to pass MEMRI, and Manosh Joon, they get all their news on Iran from him. For sure they don’t do this with ill intention, they are just uninformed and a tad ignorant.

  207. Persian Gulf says:

    Smith says:
    May 30, 2015 at 6:21 pm

    “There lies the root of our problem. The West had already given us the knowledge about iron deficiency anemia. The West had already told us about the treatment. The West had already done research about enriching food by cooking it in cast iron pots. But still it took a Western student to put 2+2 together and work it out for these retards.

    What can I say.”

    Looks like you never heard of using “horseshoe” in the pots.This has been practiced for centuries in Iran as far as I know (most probably elsewhere too). I have seen it first hand during my childhood.


    I am of course no expert of traditional medicine or the modern one for that matter. Just because it was mentioned here I thought it would be good to bring an example. To me it seems the traditional medicine is all about “prevention” and the modern one to “cure”.

  208. MassoudH says:

    Amir says: June 6, 2015 at 6:23 am

    Hi Amir

    I agree, though I would not reduce it to northern Tehran versus the rest. It’s more like a secular type (which includes many religious people) versus the rest. Hopefully, we are entering an era of greater mutual tolerance. There was the Pahlavi period of tyranny against the religiously inclined (a huge majority), followed by a backlash in the post-revolution era. This secular/theocratic divide is a potential challenge to future stability, but my personal observation during this visit makes me optimistic that we are heading in the right direction. We need more of live and let live. Would you agree?

    What’s your take B-i-B?

  209. pragmatic says:

    Many of you here are not living in Iran, henceforth you can’t really see what is going on in Iran’s society.

    1- One said Ahamadinejad lives in Narmak rather than Niavaran. You who wrote this is as populist as he is. Did you know that during his 8 year presidency he built a five story building there? Indeed living in Narmak commensurate his populist life style. So get your facts and figures right when you talk! By they way, your undermining Imam! He lived above Niavaran in Jamaran.

    2- Khooshy says that he has never seen one in US media talk so harsh and blunt about US and Israel! Indeed you are correct man! He ruined a nation with his blunt speeches, which were 100% hagwash! By the way, talk to me about Haleh Noor, Modiereyat Jahani, The girl who at age of 11 or 12 built a nuke! If I were you, I would go to youtube and start watching the clips of the above mentioned topics and then some!

    3- His excellency Ayatollah Khamenie in his famous Friday prayer post 2009 election said ” No one can claim that Hashemi Rafsanjani was a thief! He helped everyone during the combat against Shah”. So if he sells pistachio it’s better than having accounts in Venezuela!

    4- You AN supporters: Please stop anointing the 8 years of Ahamadinejad. Even Rahbari has put him aside. Rahimi’s conviction was the prelude of AN’s team to be busted.

    5- Ostensibly, Mr. Hashemi is in condescension with the hard-liners, in due time he’ll bring another trick out of his sleeves and he’ll rebuke them. How many times you Hashemi haters have to get taught by him?!

    6- In reply to Nahid Khanum there is an anecdote in Farsi which says ” گاو ما شیر نمی ده ماشالله به شاشش”

  210. MassoudH says:

    “A 2010 report by Canadian research firm Science-Metrix has put Iran in the top rank globally in terms of growth in scientific productivity with a 14.4 growth index followed by South Korea with a 9.8 growth index.[175] Iran’s growth rate in science and technology is 11 times more than the average growth of the world’s output in 2009 and in terms of total output per year, Iran has already surpassed the total scientific output of countries like Sweden, Switzerland, Israel, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Austria or that of Norway.[176][177][178] Iran with a science and technology yearly growth rate of 25% is doubling its total output every three years and at this rate will reach the level of Canadian annual output in 2017.”


  211. MassoudH says:

    pragmatic says: June 6, 2015 at 1:35 pm

    You do not sound very pragmatic.

    Khomeini lived a very simple life in a village known as Jamaran. It was quite a poor area, adjacent to Niavaran. I knew the area well as I used to lived in Niavaran.

  212. pragmatic says:

    To: Mr. Amir who wrote: Maybe you shouldn’t tie your future to someone who has always considered people as shapeless masses, easily manipulated and peasants who obey whoever feeds them.

    But, you are entitled to your opinion, maybe I’m wrong.

    Jenab Amir Khan, thanks for entitling me to my opinion, much obliged! Out of fairness: there rest don’t? Ayatollah Mesbah, Janati, Makarem and so on and so forth don’t?! Maybe at one point Hashemi did but he has changed like all of us who change in course of time, rest assured there are people that they never change!

  213. pragmatic says:

    To: MasoudH

    Hey buddy ina vaceh fati tunboon nemishe!! They need jobs to pay for the ends meat!
    Apparently this site is for Ahmadinejad’s followers! Levereth should start calling it http://www.poplusit.com

  214. Amir says:

    MassoudH says:
    June 6, 2015 at 1:24 pm

    To be honest, just as clicked and submitted my post, I thought I should have written “at least” to distinct “Irans”. I (partially) understand that there are religious people who consider Hezbollahis hypocrites and show-offs; there are hezbollahis who think anyone other than themselves are wrong; there are those opposed to West who aren’t religious at all, etc.

    And about the North of Tehran section, honestly, it’s really complex; I can’t say which one represents the majority, or even whether that matters (see link: http://didban.ir/images/upfiles/20141007/Javanan%20Irani.pdf). But, I wasn’t around 36 years ago; my understanding is that rather than a backlash, it was a the way almost everyone was. There was a revolution and you were expected to behave in a particular way, even if you didn’t believe in it.

    I don’t know you, and you could be a fantastic person, but I think we are riding a ship and one can’t say I’m just drilling where I’m sitting, and others shouldn’t be worried; Now! There’s debate what that “drilling” would constitute, but the last time I was to my hometown in Kerman, relatives were worried about changing cultural norms, and after I had one-hour-long conversation with them, some were persuaded that sticking to our Islamic traditions were best.

    So… I’m not sure if we are on the same page here, but a conversation on a web page isn’t the way to know for sure. Maybe in the end, we are not that different. A friend recently admitted that although he didn’t agree with many state policies, he doesn’t feel comfortable with so many “Western” norms, for example sexual norms.

  215. YK says:

    To all Iranians commenting on this site it’s really amazing observing the dynamism on difference of opinion in an Islamic nation contrary to what the msm would want us to believe. But taking things to the point of personal attack even though it’s your right but it’s not civil. Let’s see real debate and analysis backed by fact and not just speculations or wishful thinking. But I must be clear

  216. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 6, 2015 at 1:51 pm

    I’m not going to waste your time; you have an issue with Ahmadinejad, and you are siding with the worst possible person for that political expediency, who would leave you high and dry so very easily that you can’t imagine!

    Most important of all is for you to think why you dislike (or hate) Ahmadinejad so much, even before he became president, in 84? Why Mr Heydari looked with disbelief at him when he was saying hijab of youth isn’t our biggest problem at the moment?
    Was it because some newspapers were likening him to Le Pen and Hashemi to Mitterrand? And which journalists penned those articles? Those paid by Hashemi himself?

    So which was first? Egg or chicken? Did you hate Ahmadinejad because to loved Hashemi, or do you like Hashmei because you hated Ahmadinejad?

    What if I told you everything that Hashemi stands for is anathema to the will of the public; be institutionalized suppression of anyone who criticized his management; he tried to “buy” everyone who might oppose him; he established the oligarchy you accuse Ahmadinejad of supporting; he nurtured Rahimi and others, with whom you find faults; he once boasted of carrying out assassinations in the heart of Europe to further Iran’s prestige; he treated us like an Arbab treated his Ra’iat, and after people had seen Emam for God’s sake!

    I’ll wrap it up; it’s a moral question: do you want to associate yourself with عالیجناب کائوچیو؟ why? You seem to be young, looking to a bright future for all.
    فصل مشترک شما با کسی که با پول مردم به همین مردم فخر و مباهات میفروشد چیست؟

    And I could say at least Ayatollah Makarem is very different from Hashemi, I don’t know about the other two you mentioned.

  217. YK says:

    To all Iranians commenting on this site it’s really amazing observing the dynamism on difference of opinion in an Islamic nation contrary to what the msm would want us to believe. But taking things to the point of personal attack even though it’s your right but it’s not civil. Let’s see real debate and analysis backed by fact and not just speculations or wishful thinking. Though I believe that whatever is written about the zionist trolls is a form of self defense as their purpose on this site is to reduce the believe of more than a billion people to nothingness.

  218. pragmatic says:

    Amir says,

    The Makarem part of it ruined your entire post! Makarem :)))) The king of sugar!!
    He was a student of Ayatollah Shariatmadari. Shariatmadari was his idol, and after the revolution he became a different man. If you go to his webpage you see that he doesn’t even mention Shariatmadari as one of his teachers. And last you say I don’t know about Mesbah and Janati!! Then if you don’t know Janati then don’t comment about Irans politics.

    By the way I am not young and don’t forget Khamenie was all along with Hashemi in those years which you referred to. They were on the same bandwagen.

    Ahmadinejad ruined not only this country economically but culturally too. I don’t hate him, but I know what kind of a mendacious he was and still is.

    I am tired of arguing with people like you who think Mahmood was good because he went on CNN, MSNBC and Charlie Rose, and said bunch of none sense. So please do not lecture me. I lost a hand in war, so keep your BS to yourself. You and your friends on this page do not know what Hashemi did for this country, one day you will know.

    You guys that live in western countries all are bunch of hypocrites. You all are living all your life in France, Germany, England and USA but you hate those countries!! Why? I am sure if there is another war you will not even renew your Iranian passport. Now all of you hypocrites western haters are VATANPARAST!!

    If I were the authorities in those countries I would deport you in a second!

    Adios Amigos!

  219. M.Ali says:

    Pragmatist, I’m in Iran. And if I’m not mistaken, a lot of commentators who are supporting Ahmedinijad are in Iran such as Amir & BiB.

    But as you say that you have been in the war, please know that I thank you for supporting our country and nothing I do today is close to what you have done. Please don’t take my different opinion as an attack on you.

    Also, I would like to mention that I voted for Mousavi and I was part of the green movement for a while. But later on I realized I was wrong.

  220. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    On the topic of this thread:

    I claim that US can’t kick the Saudi habit. Too addicted to Saudi oil being denominated in US dollars.

    Any thoughts on this topic anyone?

  221. Kooshy says:

    Bussed-in Basiji says:
    June 6, 2015 at 6:12 pm
    “Any thoughts on this topic anyone?”

    As evidenced through out the history hegemonies and clientele tools, likes of US and her illegitimate client Israel, will not give up and let go until they get kicked out, so yes I agree US will not and can not give up on KSA, like she didn’t with shah’ Iran until she was kicked out and some.

  222. fyi says:

    Mr. Nasser:

    میکادونامه یا ستایش نامه ژاپن (رزمنامه ای از یک سده پیش)


  223. fyi says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 6, 2015 at 6:09 am

    What I was hoping to state was that a discussion of personal wealth and Islam is not very relevant to the situation today and the problems of Iran.

    There is the guidance of Quran as illustrated in the story of Qarun and then there is the conduct of such men among Muhajirs as the late Abdul Rahman ibn Ouf.

    The pursuit of national wealth is an essential prerequisite for national power. This national wealth is needed not just for expenditures on matters military and defense but also on matters pertaining to the general welfare of the populace.

    When the Shah wanted to pick a fight with the Tsar, the late Qaem Maqam told him not to pick a fight with a sovereign whose income exceeded the Shah’s by a factor of 10. The Shah ignored him and Iran lost Aran and Nakhchevan.

    In matters of welfare, I tried to illustrate that saving human lives requires technologies which in turn require substantial wealth to be invested in their development over very many decades.

    How can national wealth be accumulated if individuals or groups of individuals organized in share-holder companies or partnerships could not become wealthy themselves?

    Or are prevented by the state from becoming wealthy?

    Wealth is not Evil in itself nor its accumulation….

    You seemed to be suggesting the opposite and bringing the Quran and Islam into it.

    Perhaps you oppose the emergence of men such a the late Andrew Carnegie in Iran – I do not.

  224. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 6, 2015 at 4:11 pm

    Aziz-e-man, you disagree with me, that’s perfectly okay. You don’t want me to lecture you? That’s okay, too. You went to war? Thank you and اجرکم عندالله. You think I live abroad? You’re wrong.

    And don’t insult people’s Marja-e-taghlid. I said I know Ayatollah Makarem and I’ve heard about soltan-e-eshekar. He has denied it and his way of living in Qom justifies his assertions. This whole soltan-e-shaker shenanigans proves that even the opposition to the Islamic Republic is populist in nature; smear is a tactic developed by Bolsheviks, and it has trickled all the way down to دانشجویان خط امام and subsequently reformists. I have seen Ayatollah Jannati and I have heard speeches from both Ayatollah Jannati and Mesbah (and to be honest I admire Ayatollah Jannati). My English isn’t that great, so sometimes I fail to express myself correctly. Although, I had said I don’t know ABOUT them, which isn’t the same as I don’t know them, to the extent of my very limited knowledge (I meant what I know about Ayatollah Makarem couldn’t be applied to the other two).

    You are a human being and you have to demonize people to sub-human levels so you can properly hate them. And in the course you align your perspectives about others based on their associations with the object of your emotion. I also get it that you have to elevate Hashemi so that you could defend him.

    We all know about the part Hashemi played in the revolution; we know he cemented Islamists, Mojahedin-e-Khalgh and Liberals together. We know he gathered money to pay to families of those in prison (before revolution). I know other things I’m not comfortable saying them here.

    The problem is you BELIEVE I’m a gullible youth who’s been fed revisionist history of Islamic Revolution; agah jan! I know some stuff, and I don’t know others, but the picture I have put together so far, tells me that Hashemi was a “politician” in the purest sense. There was a time he suggested women with improper hijab should be sent to concentration camps and re-educated about Islamic values, and because that sold, he said these people (improper hijab) are usually the rich ones who don’t pay tithe. Now he is saying he has always believed in civil society. I’m almost certain that if public opinion turns decisively, he’ll change his tone.

    Finally, I get that Hashemi contributed to Islamic Republic and he thinks Ahmadinejad was destroying it, but Hashemi and Ahmadinejad are talking about two very different Islamic Republics; Hashemi’s version doesn’t enjoy popular support, and from what I have seen, isn’t really related to what Emam had said. This might be the defining difference between us; I think Islam should be the ultimate arbiter. Maybe you think common sense is more important, but I think Islam and common sense aren’t two separate issues; common sense dictates that Islam is ultimately the important stuff.

    خدا همه رو هدایت کنه، اگر بنده در اشتباهم لطفاً دعا بفرمایید خدا بنده رو هم هدایت کنه

  225. Amir says:

    Bussed-in Basiji says:
    June 6, 2015 at 6:12 pm

    In my humble opinion, I think Smith is right on this one; the strength of Dollar isn’t solely based on settling oil transfers in US Dollar; they produce goods and services that others are interested in purchasing, many countries hold US Federal Reserve’s bonds and would object to Dollar devaluation, and US’ economy is diverse and it has a huge domestic market for its products so it could handle that kind of pressure.

    I’m not an economist, but I think settling oil trade in currencies other than US Dollar is “the beginning of the end”, not the end. Also, as you had mentioned earlier, what’s the use if Yuan becomes an internationally accepted reserve currency and China becomes another US? Solution is somewhere else.

  226. Bussed-in Basiji says:


    Good, now we’re getting somewhere.

    I also agree that Saudi oil dollar denomination is not the only factor in the dollars hegemony. My claim is that it is significant enough factor of dollar hegemony for US to fear its demise.

    This means that US is willing to accept all the horrible consequences of being in bed with Saudis as long as oil sales remain in US dollars.

    I think what our hosts are saying is that it is logical, rational, in US long-term interests to get out of bed with Saudis- and most US elites have seemed to grasp this- but they can’t, that’s my point.

    If what you say is correct, then there is no barrier for US to separate from Saudis, right?

    The other factor is what we discussed in this forum a while back which was Amb. Freeman’s explanation of US-Saudi relationship. He said US relation with Saudi is based on three factors:

    1.Access- to Saudi oil fields and all the geopolitical and economic power this entails

    2.Transit- controlling transit of oil through the region

    3. Strategic Denial- the important one- strategically denying all this to any other actor in the globe- INCLUDING THE LOCAL PEOPLE THROUGH POPULAR GOVTS- as happened in Iran during Mossadegh and after the Islamic Revolution.

    So even if US is not dependent on Saudi oil sales in dollars- it still has to maintain relation with Ale Saud in order to strategically deny region to any other actor on the globe.

    This is what is called a “death spiral”.

  227. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    “How can national wealth be accumulated if individuals or groups of individuals organized in share-holder companies or partnerships could not become wealthy themselves?

    Or are prevented by the state from becoming wealthy?

    Wealth is not Evil in itself nor its accumulation….

    You seemed to be suggesting the opposite and bringing the Quran and Islam into it.

    Perhaps you oppose the emergence of men such a the late Andrew Carnegie in Iran – I do not.”

    As my billionaire (of the dollar and euro kind) friends here in Iran say: No better place in the world than Iran to make money, right?

    I mean where in the world can you accumulate so much wealth without paying one single cent of taxes or having to declare from where you got the billions that you are depositing in your bank account, right?

    It is not even up for discussion: the one place currently in the world that comes closest to the robber-baron era that allowed the existence of Carnegies, Rockefellers, etc. is Iran.

    And let’s not forget that it was the Republican Teddy Roosevelt that broke up their monopolies and ended that era- a great service to America if I may add.

    The problem in Iran is that unlike Carnegie and Rockefeller who invested in the US, these new robber barons have no national loyalty to Iran- you kmow the kind that “has better things to do” than to fight for his homeland when times are tough and who prefers to emigrate to the west and crawl up white peoples backsides.

    The money is accumulated but it is transferred out of the country at the smallest excuse- basically they blackmail the rest of us to get whatever they want. And the political faction that represents them in Iran is the Hashemi mafia. Agha has spoken about this matter a number of times and again last weekend at Imam’s ceremony.

    Here it is necessary that a strong government regulates the egoism and profit-lust of certain oligarchs and channels it in the right direction that benefits larger society.

    Putting your colonial faux-sophistication aside, it’s clear that you neither believe in freedom nor democracy nor human dignity- but rather in pure unadulterated oligarchy.

    Your fawning and idealization of oligarchs and proto-oligarchs belies your age and alleged sophistication. It reminds me of young teenager girls idolizing boy bands.

    It’s interesting, those that are truly noble and old-school privileged are often quite generous and caring about the less privileged in the world.

    It’s the third-world immigrant oghde-i start-ups who are often the most ruthless and vicious towards the underprivileged they originate from.

    We have two specimen of this on this forum.

  228. pragmatic says:

    To Mr. Amir,

    I read your post thoroughly and enjoyed it. At this time I do not want to get into to some of the things you alluded to. In another day I’ll do.

    Just this some quick notes:
    1- Hashemi has changed with his time and the world changes accordingly.

    2- Ahmadinejad played his cards for the others not Iran. Future will show it to you.

    3- I asked somebody here that why Ahamadinejad closed sazman barnameh and boodjeh, but no reply?!

    4- As far as today’s marjaa’s are concerned, they are mostly supported by DOWLAT’s money, so we really can’t compare them with Hazarat Ayate Ezam, Marhooman HaeiriYazdi, Broojerdi, Behbahani, Arbab, Shariatmadari, Golpayeghani, Marashi Najafi, Khonsari and Milani. The only ones that are like them to some extent are Vahid-Khorasani and Saanaie . Not even Mousavi Ardebili.

    6- As much as I do not agree with Ahmadinejad I do not agree with Khatami either. I don’t hate them! But in my opinion they both were populist.

    7- Is Mehdi Hashemi the only Aghazadeh with money issues?! Seriously? All these Mazaraties, Porsches, BMW’s, Benzes are not driven by you and I or our family members! All the drivers of these cars are below 35 years of age look at them next time. In other societies like France they call them Nuverich (sp) it means new rich. BTW, when did we start seeing all this luxury cars coming to Iran?

    I am out.

  229. Amir says:

    Bussed-in Basiji says:
    June 7, 2015 at 5:24 am

    Hmmm… I “think” it’s the part you said about declining hegemony; it’s kind of a slippery slope. If things get there, no one can tell with any certainty what would happen; one day a company defaults, the next day the whole economy gets into recession. So I “think” the US isn’t willing to take that hypothetical chance.

    The part about your question “If what you say is correct, then there is no barrier for US to separate from Saudis, right?”
    Surely there’s a barrier, you have just explained it! I meant I’m not sure if that’s enough to bring the US down, plus the whole world would get affected, so maybe others would rather see more gradual emerging of Yuan as an alternative to Dollar.

    About the geopolitical dimensions, others are more qualified.

  230. Bussed-in Basiji says:

    OK so we can conclude that US is not gonna get out of bed with Saudi even though it would the right thing morally and rationally to do so in the long-run.

    This itself is a major insight with important logical and moral consequences to ponder by those not scared of the bogeyman of “if the US collapses, the world will collapse” b.s.

    Maybe the “death spiral” I hinted at is the very way in which the world will “collapse” and ending US hegemony- dollar and otherwise- is in fact the way to prevent global collapse.

    The yuan issue you raise brings up a more fundamental question and that is do we really need a thing called “hegemonic currency”. Is “hegemonic currency” something that always exists no matter what or is it just there to scare us into accepting US structural theft within the global economy post WWII?

    Hey just saying it could be, right?

  231. Bussed-in Basiji says:


    Unlike M.H. other Porsche-driving Aghazadehs didn’t team up with MI6 and CIA to overthrow the Islamic Republic in a color revolution- with Akbar’s, Effat’s, Faezeh’s and Mohsen’s full backing and support.

    If you don’t understand this difference, than maybe you lost more than your hand in the war baradar-e razmande azizam.

  232. Amir says:

    Bussed-in Basiji says:
    June 7, 2015 at 8:39 am

    Could you please elaborate on

    “This itself is a major insight with important logical and moral consequences to ponder by those not scared of the bogeyman of “if the US collapses, the world will collapse” b.s.

    Maybe the “death spiral” I hinted at is the very way in which the world will “collapse” and ending US hegemony- dollar and otherwise- is in fact the way to prevent global collapse.”

  233. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 7, 2015 at 7:43 am

    صادقانه یک صفحه جواب نوشتم که خوشبختانه اینترنت یک لحظه قطع و وصل شد و همه ش پرید! ـ

  234. Amir says:

    They said Ahmadinejad is populist (not talking about you pragmatic!).
    Now Rouhani is saying sanctions should be ended so people can have potable water, see link: http://www.rajanews.com/news/214069
    Ahmadinejad never resorted to one tenth of this.

  235. Yk says:

    To B-in-B
    There is a report or should I say rumour that Iran as invoke the defence pact between Iran, Syria and Hezbollah. Is this true or just mere speculation, but if it’s a speculation though we all know there’s a defense pact of such between them what form do you think this pact will take going by the new successes recorded by the takfiris both in Syria and Iran?
    I for one think Iran might be walking into a quagmire if Tehran decided to deploy its troops which is exactly what the west want unless it would be in form of limited special forces. The US plan for this proxy war to take a long time and drain the resources of Iran, because they are convinced of the necessity to pivot to Asia to curtail China’s growing influence but at the same time they need to keep the growth of the IRI in check or drain it but they do not have the resources to be on this fronts at the same time so they choose the next best alternative and cost effective means -proxy war by the ignorant ones on their behalf paid for by their client State and the signing of a nuclear agreement.

    Another question I would like to ask B-in-B is that: Do you think Iran can continue to counter this proxy war in low intensity without committing large troops in the long run?

  236. Yk says:

    To B-in-B
    There is a report or should I say rumour that Iran as invoke the defence pact between Iran, Syria and Hezbollah. Is this true or just mere speculation, but if it’s a speculation though we all know there’s a defense pact of such between them what form do you think this pact will take going by the new successes recorded by the takfiris both in Syria and Iran?
    I for one think Iran might be walking into a quagmire if Tehran decided to deploy its troops which is exactly what the west want unless it would be in form of limited special forces. The US plan for this proxy war to take a long time and drain the resources of Iran, because they are convinced of the necessity to pivot to Asia to curtail China’s growing influence but at the same time they need to keep the growth of the IRI in check or drain it but they do not have the resources to be on this fronts at the same time so they choose the next best alternative and cost effective means -proxy war by the ignorant ones on their behalf paid for by their client State and the signing of a nuclear agreement.
    Another question I would like to ask B-in-B is that: Do you think Iran can continue to counter this proxy war in low intensity without committing large troops in the long run?

  237. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 7, 2015 at 7:43 am

    Thanks for your reply, and the time you spent to read my post.

    I’ll summarize my post into two sentences: Hashemi had killed our belief in the system and Ahmadinejad revived it.

  238. Yk says:

    Simply saying Hashemi became pragmatic to the point of sacrificing principles while Ahmadinejad reintroduced principle. Or am I wrong?

  239. Amir says:

    Yk says:
    June 7, 2015 at 11:16 am

    That’s a good way of putting it!

    And you said principle, and reminded me of Principalists (اصولگرایان); there’s one man (Ahmadinejad) who has been like a shield for them in the past decade, and now that they suppose he’s been excluded from politics they are saying “oh! we never fully agreed with him!” or “I was the first person to warn about his malign intentions” but if he manages to return they’ll attach themselves to him like leeches (although Ahmadinejad has said time and again that he’s not beholden to Reformists, Principalists, or anyone else).

    I’m sorry, I’m very tired. Maybe I’d better stop posting for tonight.

  240. Smith says:

    Nasser says:
    June 6, 2015 at 4:44 am

    “At this rate we will never ever catch up.”

    If there is only one lesson to be learnt from Soviet Union and Russian history is this: Catch up game always fails. Only those who become ground-breakers will be the alphas, not because they want to catch up to this or that, but because of their inherent genuine and authentic desire for exploration, for new knowledge and for innovation. Those who truly and in every sense of the word want to understand more and question every single idea new and old (not writing fake articles, in order to jack up their fake rankings; writing articles in the hope of producing knowledge is exactly like building a zigzagging runway with the bamboo control tower to attract planes).

    Such a thinking society sees old wisdom as a piece of archaeological relic that is not a guide for a magically happy life but as something to be challenged. The one rule of the game is quite straight forward, fair and square: Empirical evidence leading to explanation of the universe or vice versa. We are not the creators of this world we are living in, Mr Nasser. We are just the hackers of it.

    Magic does not hack it. Science on the other hand hacks the universe by tapping into and using the laws of universe for purposes of humanity. The old hacks that everyone has heard and overused become overtime like common jokes in parties. It is only the new hacks that bring out the awe. Of both men and gods. Unlike magic, science can not remain secret and be based on forgery and lies. Science has no tolerance for hypocrisy and the hope in physical salvation by divine intervention. Science has absolutely no tolerance for illusions about cause and effect.

    It is a story in making. The story of universe. Attempting to copy it, fails every time since the story is still in progress. How can you copy a story that has not been concluded? The only way to do it, is by being at the forefront among the original writers of the story.

    TV was invented in West. As was radio. By the 70’s, the Japanese had taken over and become extremely proficient in manufacturing of TV and radios. So proficient that they drove American makers of TV and radio out of business. The common man on American street who functions much at the level of a third world commoner thought this is the end. That the American electronic industry is dead. By then the thinkers of the white tribe came up with yet another invention as they have been consistently for the past 600 years without fail: WorldWideWeb goes on line in 1990. The rest of the world including Japanese only could watch in awe as a new era began, yet another era all brought about by the white man, the only thinker of universe, the god of thinking.

    I would not even call what East Asia and China are doing as competition. Competition happens when two sides are playing the same game. This is not the case here. The white man confidently is exploring and toying with universe around himself. The East Asians are just part of his game not outside it. He creates East Asia. He has become so confident in unthinking ability of the rest of the world that he does not even need to worry about competition. He lets East Asia know the inside out of iPhone so much so that he lets them manufacture it for him. The original, not even the copy. But he is confident enough that the East Asians will not be able to come up with its next version. No need to even copy. The white man lets you make and have the original. After all he will be coming up with a better one next month/year/decade. How can you compete with such a force? It was possible to copy a magician, a traditional wise man and a frozen body of knowledge. But how do you copy a system whose core ideology is based on change and challenge?

    If tomorrow or day after, the West comes up with quantum computing, what do you think will happen with East Asia? Can they compete?

    If tomorrow or day after, the West learns to harness the dark matter, what do you think will happen with East Asia? Can they compete?

    If tomorrow or day after, the West comes up with AI sufficiently sophisticated to function at the level of a general laborer, what do you think will happen with East Asia? Can they compete?

    Or for that matter any other new thing. It has been happening for 600 years now. Without fail.

    And Huntington is wrong. The Western domination of planet is not because they hold “control” over things like hard currency or sea lanes. Absolutely not. It is because they have almost a monopoly over thinking. The rest of the planet is functioning at various levels of a cargo cult. Iran begs in choreographed negotiations to be allowed to sell its oil and get cargo, another nation accepts Apple as the alpha and offers its cheap labor in sweat shops, and yet another nation has to become an outright pirate snatching its cargo by the trick if not by physical force on high seas: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/18/world/asia/fake-diplomas-real-cash-pakistani-company-axact-reaps-millions-columbiana-barkley.html

    Mr Nasser, gods seldom need to come down to factory floor and do the job that can be done by red Indians, blacks, Russians, Taiwanese, Chinese and Iranians. They have more important things to do. Such as deliberation, imagination, pondering, wondering, and toying with the universe. It does not mean, they are failing or are about to. And if ever it comes to that, rest assured these are the same American people who during the world war 2, their women came out of the kitchens and manufactured war planes at the mind boggling rate of one new plane per ten minutes, day and night, year on year, while their men were fighting. Iranians both men and women during the entire war with Saddam produced Zero planes and Zero tanks.

  241. pragmatic says:

    To Ahmadinejad, Mashaie, Baghaie, Elham and HashemiSamareh Supporter!

    خدا رحمت کنه دکتر شریعتی رو که همه جا میگفت حقیقت رو فدای مصلحت نکنید

    Dr. Shariati, who said don’t sacrifice the truth by the interest.

  242. pragmatic says:


    You are wrong! Ahmadinejad was brought to power to put aside Jamaranies! It back fired! As the Texans say: He is all big hat but no cattle!!

    Mr. Amir said that Mehdi Hashemi wanted to overthrow the government!! If so, then why is he not in prison? The answer is one of the following:

    1- He is innocent and people without having a proof put label on him.

    2- The Godfather is too strong to be touched!

  243. Karl.. says:

    Does Iran have anything in common with the arabworld?
    How many times havent Iran tried to establish good relations just to be ignored?
    Should Iran stop this relentless efforts?

    “Iran call on arab states regarding Israel”

  244. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 8, 2015 at 3:54 am

    Well, I didn’t say anything about Mehdi Hashemi really, but I’ve heard he has received a sentence, to which his lawyers have filed an appeal, and it’ll be some time before a verdict is out.

    I understand that the Judiciary doesn’t act as “independently” as it should, but because I guess the negotiations would fail, and the political fortunes of Hashemi would dwindle if Reouhani can’t get re-elected in 96, I “think” there’s the possibility that eventually Mehdi Hashemi would serve some time behind the bars (not that long though). Fa’ezeh Hashemi went to Evin prison, didn’t she?

    Probably you are referring to earlier posts, and there’s the possibility that more than two people with the name of Amir have posted on this site. Also, sometimes we engage in “reading between the lines”; if you ask me, Mehdi Hashemi actively carried out illegal activities; when you put statements by Abbas Yazdanpanah Yazdi, Nik Ahang Kowsar, Faezeh Hashmei (several days after 2009 election) and Mehdi Hashemi himself together, even I would say there was something more far reaching than just objecting to possible irregularities in an election.

    Kermanis say Hashemi has been selling the country piecemeal. There’s so much that I’m not sure about, but I can’t easily dismiss. From rapid exportation of sulfur gathered in northeast (by-product of gas fields there, gathered over several decades), to Molybdenum in Khatun Abad mine, to gas deal with UAE… I could say Hashemi doesn’t care about wasting other’s money; he thinks the river bed gets wet when water passes through it, so greasing some people’s palms is inevitable, necessary or even desirable.

    And one thing for Mr Pragmatic! The whole time Hashemi has looked at the internal politics of Iran as a family business; when Ahmadinejad emerged he took it as a personal affront to himself (and by extension to the Revolution, because he thinks he has masterminded the whole thing, he has brought Emam from Paris, he has managed the war, he has presided over recovery after war, etc). People on the other hand (including yourself, who aren’t a servant of Hashemi’s clan, but someone who sees he’s the lesser of all evils) have little affection for Hashemi, or any other individual. Hashemi hasn’t declared war on Ahmadinejad alone, he has declared war on the people.

  245. pragmatic says:

    To: Haleh Noor Supporters,

    Just in…
    معاون اجرایی احمدی نژاد بازداشت شد
    حجت‌الاسلام محسنی اژه‌ای در هشتادمین نشست خبری خود با اصحاب رسانه با اعلام این خبر، افزود: حمید بقایی معاون رئیس جمهور سابق پرونده اتهامی در قوه قضاییه داشت که بازپرس پرونده این فرد را امروز برای بازجویی احضار کرد.
    وی افزود: پس از برگزاری جلسه بازپرس پرونده برای این شخص قرار بازداشت صادر کرد و به این ترتیب این فرد اکنون در بازداشت به سر می‌برد.

    محسنی اژه‌ای گفت: متاسفانه به دلیل مسائل قانونی از بیان جزئیات اتهامی این فرد معذور هستم.

    منبع: ایرنا

    Soon it’ll be Mahmoud’s turn….

  246. pragmatic says:

    Mr. Amir

    Once again I read your post very carefully, but I didn’t like it this time! Because it was based on assumptions! He said, she said….. Since when NikAhangeh Koosar is a source!! Come on dude! I won’t correspond with you any more like FYI!! A person whose source is Nik Ahang then there is no need for further discussion!! It was nice chatting with you dude.
    Long Live Iran

  247. pragmatic says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 6, 2015 at 1:35 pm


    4- You AN supporters: Please stop anointing the 8 years of Ahamadinejad. Even Rahbari has put him aside. Rahimi’s conviction was the prelude of AN’s team to be busted.
    Rahimi’s conviction was the prelude of AN’s team to be busted.
    Rahimi’s conviction was the prelude of AN’s team to be busted.
    Rahimi’s conviction was the prelude of AN’s team to be busted.


    Apparently, they are crossing Doc’s red lines?!!!!

  248. Amir says:

    pragmatic says:
    June 8, 2015 at 7:31 am

    Thanks for your attention and patience. I was merely stating my limited understanding. Just because you had mentioned my name next to a statement (Mehdi Hashemi acting to topple the state) I felt obliged to write some incoherent sentences.

    Bottom line is the way you don’t like Ahmadinejad, I don’t like Hashemi and me finding faults with his actions isn’t delusional; you too thought he has made mistakes in the past. But you think Ahmadinejad is worse.

  249. Amir says:

    Where’s Rehmet with an analysis of Parliamentary election in Turkey? Anyone?

  250. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 7, 2015 at 8:55 pm

    This is true as far as it goes.

    However, please note that things like Newtonian and Quantum Mechanics, the Germ Theory of Disease, the structure of DNA etc. are singular & seminal discoveries which cannot be expected to be surpassed any time soon – perhaps for centuries.

    That is, the profundity and significance of such discoveries and constructions as above is so high that similar discoveries like them are precluded.

    Which means that the mastering of the Applied Arts derived from such discoveries will get non-Western states to a comfortable place from which they could exercise some autonomous development – in politics, in Applied Sciences, etc.

    That is, gone are the days of gun-boats diplomacy with respect to China, Russia and many others.

    Future historical developments will indicate how will these non-Western societies use this knowledge and know-how that they have gleaned from Western world.

    Will they use it as a platform for further application of Reason and Insight into the Universe or will they sit on that platform and do nothing more than waiting for the next application to show up in the West to be adopted.

  251. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    June 8, 2015 at 11:29 am

    I am agreed with you.

    These nations still function in the realm of magic.

    The West invented jet engines. They started by using lightweight alloys for turbine blades. Russians copied it and Chinese tried to copy it with various level of success. Then West went into single crystal blades (the turbine blade is actually a single crystal). Again Russians and then Chinese tried to copy it with various level of success. Now West is going into resin composite blades which change shape under centrifugal forces of turbine. The process of original thinking is continuing in West. I am not sure about others.


    In a sense what you were saying and what Dr Jafarian is saying is right. Iran does not have a functioning civilization and such a civilization can not be built even in a hundred years. I knew that money is not really important in this process but what caught my eyes was:

    به علاوه که نزاع تمدنها که همیشه وجود داشته و دارد، و این که یکی بر بقیه غلبه کند یا رنگ عالم را به خود اختصاص دهد، نیاز به زمینه ها و پیش زمینه های فراوانی دارد که اصلا نمی تواند حتی در صد سال و یا با فشار و تزریق پول و یا توصیه و نصیحت ایجاد شود.

    That even توصیه و نصیحت is useless.

    It seems this unthinking nation will remain an unthinking one long after we are dead and in all probability forever.

    Then under such conditions, Dr Rouhani is right that we have to bow down to kadkhoda and Dr Zarif was right when he said the Iranian weapons are useless compared to American military power.

    Couple of weeks ago, a celebrity military commander of Iran, was very disappointed on why Obama had not dispatched his airforce to help him in Iraq against Isis. He was full of steam.

    My question from him is this: Isis does not have an airforce. Against such a force when it is moving in a long column to attack cities even World War II era planes are effective. Even planes like B-17 and Ju 88 would have been deadly and would have spared Iran depending on American air support in Iraq (and by extension Syria). Why Iran can not produce something like one thousand B-17 and Ju 88 planes? Is it because Iran still can not produce World War II era internal combustion engines? Mr commander if you still can not do that, then how about the AEG GIV the German plane of World War One? I mean this is from one hundred years ago. You can’t even find them in museums anymore.

    Oh, I see. The world including Iran’s military needs kadkhoda and his attention. And like the traditional kadkhoda as long kadkhoda is taking your side, he is good and if he does not then he is bad. So childish.

    Go figure why Germany in 19th century had a company like AEG that could produce planes which Iran still can’t.

  252. Karl.. says:

    I have asked this question before with no response, all you here who smear (sometimes your own people!) for not being creative in your view, what have you produced in this world? Who are you to complain about others like that when you yourself are probably no way “better”?
    Alot of talk about lousy iranians using western technology, should they stop? Arent you yourself using this technology every day and most likely have no urge to create something “new”? You are talking about this amazing utopia for Iran that will not occur anytime soon (100 years).

  253. fyi says:

    Karl.. says:

    June 8, 2015 at 2:42 pm

    I have various accomplishments to my name that I do not wish to disclose.

    The issue really is that Knowledge is Power and without the capacity to analyze the world, generate new knowledge, and then apply it one can never hope to fight against domination by alien peoples.

    Significantly, EU states tried to destroy Iran, because they thought they could and not because Iran was a threat to them.

    That capacity of foreigners to intervene in Muslim states and do whatever they wish is crucially dependent on the Knowledge deficit among Muslim states. That has to be remedied.

  254. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 8, 2015 at 2:42 pm

    باید خود جوش باشد مثل کارهای مرحوم مرتضی پاشایی –

    نه دستگاه به وی کمکی کرد نه نهادی – خودش بود و دوستانش و خانواده

  255. Karl.. says:


    Ok and you came up with these innovations inside Iran? Or do you compare your innovations with an iranian inside Iran? I am going to give you credit if it is the former not the latter.

    Yes knowledge=power but isnt this what Iran is already is doing? Arent the ranking for Iran looking better each year?
    But this thing that Iran will go beyond marverlous west is simply not going to happen so why bother with all these unrealistic utopias? Or do you think Iran will reach the level set by western states? In how many years? Decades? Centuries? Whats the plan? Or is there no realistic base regarding these views at all?

  256. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    June 8, 2015 at 3:11 pm

    Very right. After all if it is not the case then people like Boltzmann would never appear.

    But at the very least Iran needs this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academic_freedom

    I do not see how any progress can be hoped for without this. When industrialists are hanged and the dalals are treated honorably, we can still have miniscule hope for change in future. But when ideas are murdered and the thinkers are imprisoned and inquiry is seen as a “Jewish conspiracy” then hope itself dies.

  257. fyi says:

    Karl.. says:

    June 8, 2015 at 3:44 pm

    I do not need your credits and how do you think you are to arrogate to yourself who should and should not comment about this or that topic based on this or that credential or accomplishments?

  258. Karl.. says:


    Well who are you talking to then if you dont seek support or are unable to show any base for your for your arguments here? If you cant even reach out on this small site, how do you think you will reach out with this utopian views to the whole nation of Iran?

  259. fyi says:

    Karl.. says:

    June 8, 2015 at 4:34 pm

    I have stated my opinions based on my own efforts to understand the world.

    That is all.

  260. Smith says:

    Mr Nasser,

    Why the west is leading the world: https://www.sciencenews.org/article/quantum-meets-chemistry-opening-galaxy-possibility

    It is not a “Jewish conspiracy” funded by “Saudi oil”.

    It is the brute force of science.

    Magic has no chance, no matter how many believe in it.

  261. Smith says:

    The future generation of battle tanks with magical armor (don’t forget your mosquito repellent lotion): http://www.mashreghnews.ir/files/fa/news/1394/1/26/981117_579.jpg

  262. MassoudH says:

    Outstanding analysis:


    ““Simply put, agreement with consumers, and the use of energy credit instruments. The concept of an international natural gas clearing union has been around for a while, and an Iranian colleague of mine long since proposed that Iran, Russia and China might act as founders of such a union – a G3 – with the Caspian region becoming the global gas price reference point or benchmark.”

    “So perhaps instead of oil being priced in dollars (or even euros) and gas then being priced against oil as now, we may then come to see oil, dollars and euros all priced against gas?””

  263. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 8, 2015 at 6:20 pm

    Actually this is a good vehicle for sandy desert warfare.

  264. fyi says:

    MassoudH says:

    June 8, 2015 at 7:34 pm

    I agree with this.

    And I think we are seeing the oil swap having started with Iran this week.

    I think Iran should leave OPEC and sell her oil on the spot market.

    Government can de-nationalize the oil sector and sell at a certain price to privatized companies to maintain stable budgetary revenue. The private buyers and sellers could then make or lose money.

  265. Sineva says:

    Smith says:
    June 8, 2015 at 6:20 pm
    I guess the americans must believe in “magic” armor as well,right?

  266. MassoudH says:

    Amir says:
    June 6, 2015 at 1:59 pm

    This is a crucial point about tolerance. Essentially, you can compete for influence or enforce it. The conversation you had with your family back home was a case of competition, and they chose to agree with you. Freely. What then is the value – at the political level – in banning influence by others? It’s a weak strategy for any free country. And why allow the state to define social values? Should the state not follow social values instead? Social values are determined by all kinds of people. Why not allow for individual freedom to choose one’s values? I guess it boils down to community orientation versus individualism.

    But is there really a clearly definable (singular) community with obviously shared social values in Iran? Iran’s historical hallmark has been its diversity.

  267. BiBiJon says:

    Karl.. says:
    June 8, 2015 at 3:44 pm

    A very pertinent question you ask: What is the plan?

    fyi, and smith and one or two co-travelers have very little expertise in anything in particular. Long gone are scholars like Fioragella, Empty, and Eric Brill.

    But, their persistence at demonizing, and ridiculing Iran, all things Iranian, and anything Islamic, is to reduce the chances of the world powers engaging seriously with Iran.

    Self-deprecation has its place in healthy doses of course. It is important to see one’s own shortcomings. But when you see folks upend a conversation thread constantly, and persistently, one wonders why?

    Paul Pillar has an nice piece demolishing the Iranian destabilizing influence myth which is based on the highly focused, determined, capable, and serious portrayal of Iran that should be confronted by all means at all costs.

    These two-bit pseudo scientist, orientalist trolls, fyi and smith are just here to attack iran from the other direction. The constant portrayal of Iran/Iranians/Moslems as incurious, eclectic, incapable and distracted, backward, etc. is supposed to provide another reason why Iran should not be engaged by world powers. If you cannot get Iran’s destruction by military force, and you cannot get Iran’s strangulation by sanctions, at least lets try and get Iran’s isolation.

    As a bonus, the trolls derail any meaningful conversation by their inane insults, and turn off more serious posters on this site who have interesting observations.

    Perhaps knowing their agenda helps to see their comments in perspective.

  268. pragmatic says:

    Mostafa Malekian Iranian philosopher


  269. Smith says:

    fyi says:
    June 8, 2015 at 7:58 pm

    Yes, it is. In fact US and others are developing air drop-able unmanned robotic vehicles of similar layout. Though this one, as Mr Nasser put it, is a showpiece solution.

    The recent wars in Syria and Iraq and other such wars in history such as South African border war and the Chechnya war proved that to effectively fight proxy guerrilla forces, heavily armored infantry fighting vehicles are of paramount importance. Otherwise the causality rates are going to be high.

    Causality rates matter since Shias are in minority and generally have lower total fertility rates.

  270. Smith says:

    The industrialist got hanged and all the debts paid: http://www.donya-e-eqtesad.com/news/886456/

    Thank God. Now other industrialists and producers can have the trust and confidence that they will get justice.

    What happened to dalals by the way? Any news?

  271. Smith says:

    رییس سازمان مدیریت و برنامه ریزی کشور با بیان این که مسوول برنامه ریزی کشور هستم، خاطر نشان کرد: دولت نهم و دهم طی هشت سال بیش از 800 میلیارد دلار از محل فروش روزانه چهار میلیون بشکه نفت به ارزش هر بشکه 108 دلار درآمد داشته و خورده شد و چیزی باقی نمانده است.


  272. Karl.. says:

    June 8, 2015 at 10:21 pm

    Fully agree, there is no wrong to advance the nation and admit shortcomings etc but this demonzation and these slogans that doesnt mean anything apparently – because obviously there is no plan, there is no even basic ideas how Iran should evolve there just is criticism for the sake of criticism.
    Isnt this issue very similar what the Shah thought and later led to his fall? I think it is, so why go the same route again? It makes no sense.

  273. M. Ali says:

    Karl, its better you do not engage with them. Watching their circle jerking with “Yes, Mr so and so, you are so right kisses kisses” has moved from being annoying to uncomfortable. I feel like I’m watching a private session of cultists massaging each other.

    These guys are not any different than the billions around the world that sit in their chair, eating chips and drinking beer and shouting at the news, giving 10 solutions every 2 minutes.

    I’ve previously pleaded with them to stop their posts because it has absolutely nothing with the topic of the site nor the posts, and as it is, they are completely ruining the site. With their super-genius-brains they could start a website and call it “IraniansAreStupid.com” and they could discuss it to their hearts content.

    But apparently this genius that they are looking for, means that you jump into any group and sit down and rant and rave for YEARS.

    It would be like me talking about Iranian cinema or music or something completely unrelated.

  274. Amir says:

    MassoudH says:
    June 8, 2015 at 8:34 pm

    Perhaps we are talking about different things. No one is against open discussion. And the people who are actively opposing religion are competitively furthering their cause through satellite TV stations and web pages.

    The problem could be broken along two lines; one is the fault that the state finds with Western values. This is similar to the situation of Christians in Sassanian Persia; after they were massacred by one of Shapours, they decided to establish their independent Curia in Iran (Eastern Roman Empire instigated revolt among them, when it was waging a war against Sassanian dynasty).
    We know Iranians with Western values aren’t traitors, and many of them are fierce patriots, but the way EU boasts every now and then about “Iranian women pushing boundaries” and “Iranian youth challenging Islamic and Revolutionary values” infuriates policy makers (and maybe make some nervous, or cautious).

    By the way, did you find time to read the link I sent you? It’s lengthy, but worth the time.

    The part you mentioned about “live and let live” should be viewed in a historic perspective; Zoroastrians have been living among us for many many years, but they have respected the boundaries. Even the Bahai didn’t have a horrible life up until to 2004-5 when G. W. Bush took upon himself to focus on human rights in Iran; emboldened by a foreign power support, (I remember it!) they started asking for more rights, and if history has taught a lesson, that would only complicate matters. Post-2009 election events made the situation even worse. Believe it or not, ordinary Iranians held a grudge against Bahais, and now the security apparatus is on their tail.

    Others have suggested that if the state didn’t feel threatened by Western countries, it wouldn’t be so concerned with everything Western. I “think” if the sanctions aren’t lifted, and some crazy people wouldn’t stir up trouble, a new equilibrium would emerge and some tensions and restrictions would be eased. You have seen before each election some restrictions are relaxed;; imagine Iran would be in pre-election mode, indefinitely. If a war is to happen, let the people enjoy their last minutes in peace, right?

    Now! About my perspective, I have come to the conclusion that Quran is in its own words ان هو الا ذکر للعالمین لمن شاء منکم ان یستقیم و ماتشائون الا ان یشاء الله رب العالمین
    Like I would argue for public sanitation, vaccination, preventive medicine (all fruits of Western Medicine, by the way, not the works of my grandmother or any other person of my relatives), I would argue for the importance of religion in every single individual’s life; medicine saves your life which could last for 80, 100 or 200 years, but religion is about eternity. Eternity if far vastly more important.

  275. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 9, 2015 at 3:12 am

    You have to take the words of such people with a lot of caution.

    They lie or deliberately distort facts – take that $ 800 billion figure – no attempt is made to correct for inflation and put it in perspective.

    Nor anyone is stating that Iran has been in an economic war for the past 5 years and wars cost money.

  276. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 9, 2015 at 3:10 am

    Yes a step in the wrong direction, blaming Dr. Ahmadinejad and his innovations.

    So, they want the state back in the game of selling oil….

    The fact of the matter is that Dr. Ahmadinejad’s government was innovative – such as the one criticized in the above article to which you had supplied the URL, such as Maskan Mehr and others.

    Now, some innovations fail and some succeed and that is just the nature of innovations and inventions.

    The most important thing is not that some have been failures or some have been successful – the most important thing has been the act of innovation and belief in oneself and one’s ability to be creative.

    So, I say Kudos to Dr. Ahmadinejad and his ministers that managed to be innovative and effective – all the while working under near-war or war conditions.

  277. fyi says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 8, 2015 at 11:51 pm

    The man knows no philosophy nor economics.

    He is a small man barking at the moon.

  278. fyi says:

    Smith says:

    June 9, 2015 at 3:08 am

    Yes, I agree that the punishment for the late Mr. Beh-Afarid was excessive and out of line.

    I do not believe that economic crimes ought to be treated as capital crimes where human life has been lost directly.

  279. fyi says:

    Sineva says:

    June 8, 2015 at 8:05 pm

    The effectiveness of any weapons system can only be firmly established during war or combat operations.

    But the important thing is that Iranians are trying to develop their own systems and platforms with their own resources.

    And evidently they are paying attention to what is going on outside of Iran – already working on robots.

    My concern would be that this type of innovation and inventiveness be confined only to military industries and not civilian ones.

    If you go to the museums in Iran, there are many interesting fire-arms that were built by Iranian artisan and gunsmiths over the last few centuries – but they were all copies of earlier European models.

    The camel-mounted zanboorak was the single innovative product that I ever saw.

  280. pragmatic says:


    With all do respect could you kindly enlighten us with the names of those innovative ministers? And their innovations?

    I am perplexed!

  281. Sineva says:

    fyi says:
    June 9, 2015 at 10:03 am
    Yes I know,I was just pointing it out to mr smith that the us has developed a near identical weapon and I very much doubt that the americans believe in his “magic armor” any more than iran does.The truth is that these sorts of fast light tracked vehicles,not main battle tanks by the way mr smith,are very well suited to recon work and it makes good military sense to develop them.

  282. fyi says:

    pragmatic says:

    June 9, 2015 at 10:07 am

    I already did – Makan Mehr.

  283. Rehmat says:

    ‘Nelson Mandela, forever’ – Iranian film

    Islamic Iran had a special place in Mandel’s heart. Tehran supported ANC’s armed resistance against the South African apartheid regime which was supported by the US, Israel and the entire Zionist-controlled western world. after his release from prison in 1992, the first foreign country Nelson visited was Islamic Republic of Iran. During his visit Mandela thanked Iranian nation for its supports for the enslaved Black people of South Africa.

    Nelson Mandela met Iran’s spiritual leader Ayatullah Ali Khameni and called him My Leader. Watch a video below.


  284. Rehmat says:

    fyi – No wonder a great number of Jew oligarchs who looted Gentiles are living in Israel.


  285. Karl.. says:

    Is this “creative” according to our critics here?

    Iran to produce new indigenous destroyers

  286. fyi says:


    Dr. Gelb on US Strategy vs. Russia:


    Note to Iranians:

    We read Mr. Putin stating:

    “We will not under any circumstances turn our back on the potential for strategic deterrence, and we will reinforce it. It was precisely this which allowed us to maintain state sovereignty during the most difficult period of the 1990s.”